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  • We Need To Talk About The Brocks


    Image courtesy of Anne-Marie Sorvin via Imagn Images
    Tony Abbott

    If you buy into the hype, it seems like the Minnesota Wild have uncovered the NHL's latest market inefficiency: Dudes from Minnesota named Brock.

    It's easy to see why the Wild would be into that. After all, it's working out amazingly with Brock Faber. The hometown kid stepped right into an NHL lineup and has been lights-out as a top defenseman for the Wild, and the front office has made him a long-term cornerstone of the franchise.

    The Wild are about six months away from "Christmas Morning," when the worst of the Zach Parise/Ryan Suter buyouts fade off the books, allowing the team to use an influx of cap space to shore up their team. Given their investment in trading for David Jiricek, along with Zeev Buium's imminent arrival and Faber's presence, Minnesota would obviously look to upgrade at forward.

    Mikko Rantanen and Mitch Marner are the big fish of the pending UFA crop. However, all signs from insiders point to the Wild pursuing one or both of two dudes from Minnesota named Brock:

    Brock Nelson and Brock Boeser.

    From The Athletic's Michael Russo in Tuesday's mailbag with Joe Smith: "[Minnesota's] cap space isn’t infinite, but it would allow for a potential Brock Nelson signing and, truly depending on what happens with [Marco] Rossi, maybe even somebody like Brock Boeser."

    At first glance, that sounds awesome. Nelson is off to a slower-than-normal start (13 goals, 28 points in 46 games), but the 6-foot-4 center had 107 goals in the three seasons prior, with no year fewer than 34. Boeser put it all together for the Vancouver Canucks last year, notching his first 40-goal season. Who's turning down their nose at 75 goals?

    Should it be the Wild?

    The answer is, as always, Depends on money and term.

    Obviously, either would be a bargain on a sweetheart Eric Staal deal and not so much on a Leon Draisaitl-type contract. That's not a helpful answer, though, so let's attach some hard numbers to it. Using Evolving-Hockey's contract projections (which are based on last year's stats and ages), let's bump up the cap to $92.5 million and see what outputs we get for these players:

    Brock Nelson: three years, $7.81 million AAV
    Brock Boeser: seven years, $8.68 million AAV

    OK. Evolving-Hockey pegs Nelson as a shorter-term option, similar to that of Joe Pavelski (three years, $7M AAV) with the Dallas Stars in 2019, while Boeser is making top-line winger money for a long-term deal.

    Are either worth it? Both?

    At first glance, Nelson is the player who has the most red flags. Age is the biggest one; he'll turn 34 around Opening Day of the 2025-26 season. And while his status as a 6-foot-4 center would typecast him as a two-way, Joel Eriksson Ek type who can absorb those hard minutes, that's not exactly Nelson's game. Nelson is decidedly a one-way player and a defensive liability at this stage of his career.

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    So why risk getting older and worse defensively? Especially since his decline in scoring could be a sign that the years are already catching up to him.

    Normally, this would be inadvisable, but Nelson provides two things the Wild need more of. The first is his ability to drive offense, which Minnesota can use, regardless of the age that package comes in. Over the past three seasons, the Wild rank 29th in actual and expected goals per hour at 5-on-5. Both numbers are well below the New York Islanders, who most consider a punchless offensive team.

    But the other, more surprising attribute is speed. Nelson can move. And for a 6-foot-4, 33-year-old player, Nelson can really move. His bursts above 20 mph rank him among the NHL's best.

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    When most people talk about the attributes the Wild lack, the people focus on size. Arguably, their greater weakness is their speed. Minnesota has some quick forwards (Kirill Kaprizov comes to mind) but lack high-end speed. Their team speed has improved due to internal improvements (namely, Marco Rossi) and adding Yakov Trenin. Still, adding Nelson's wheels would add another mobile center to the mix, which is always helpful.

    And again, there's Nelson's nose for the net. Over the past four seasons, he's tied with Carter Verhaeghe for the 12th-most 5-on-5 goals in the NHL with 77, one more than Kaprizov. From his age-29-to-32 seasons, he ranks among the most efficient goal-scorers in his age group during the Analytics Era.

    Most 5-on-5 Goals Per Hour, Ages 29 to 32:

    Max Pacioretty (2018-22): 1.20
    Alex Ovechkin (2015-19): 1.19
    Brad Marchand (2017-21): 1.19
    Brock Nelson (2021-25): 1.18
    Jeff Skinner (2021-25): 1.18
    Rick Nash (2013-17): 1.18

    At least among those players, when they're scoring at that level in their early 30s, the bigger risk factor is injury, not decline. Ovechkin is a freak, so no one can count on Nelson bumping his goals per hour figure into the 1.41 range, as Ovi did from ages-33-to-35. But in Marchand's next three seasons, he averaged a still-strong 0.89 goals per hour, and even an injury-plagued Nash scored 1.03 goals per hour when he could play.

    It's not going to be risk-free, by any means, but you can do a lot worse in signing 34-year-olds than with a big, fast, scoring center in Nelson.

    So, what about Boeser? He seems like an ideal grab in free agency: A 40-goal scorer hitting the market at age 28. If you're going to invest seven years and big dollars into free agency, Boeser is the right age to do that.

    However, the Burnsville Brock has some red flags of his own, and his might be even brighter than Nelson's. Much like Nelson, Boeser's defensive value is also in the bottom 10th percentile.

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    Ironically, Boeser's defense might be more alarming because of his age. In his prime, Nelson was about replacement-level defensively. He didn't necessarily add value but also wasn't a liability. When he got into his early 30s, his defense started dropping off. While it's a problem, it doesn't eat away at his overall value too much.

    Minnesota would have Boeser at the tail end of his prime to start with, but once he gets to his early 30s, it's a safe bet that his defensive play will start to slip, and there's nowhere to fall from where he is except to bottom-of-the-barrel. 

    Boeser also lacks the speed element that Nelson would bring; he's one of the slowest top-six forwards in the NHL. That's also not something that improves as a player transitions from their prime to their early 30s.

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    Speed is far from the end-all, be-all for a forward, but lacking it does come with inherent limitations. Boeser is all but eliminated as a puck-carrying option for his line, and when a player isn't able to offer much in the defensive or neutral zones, they need a superpower to make it work. Credit to Boeser, his shot is a superpower that makes his overall game work. It's one of the hardest and most accurate in the NHL. 

    But when you think of the hardest declines in Wild history, two names come to mind: Dany Heatley and Thomas Vanek, who cratered in value in their early 30s. What did they have in common? Heatley and Vanek were slow skaters and weak defenders who relied on elite shots.

    It was game over for Heatley once he lost the zip on his shot. Vanek's hands still made him a viable offensive player in Minnesota. However, his defense dropped off from "bad" to "worst in the league" territory, making him unfit for anything but power play specialist duties late in his career. Boeser might be able to break out of that trend, but 40-goal-scorer or not, that feels like a bad bet to risk a seven-year deal on.

    That's especially true when you factor in positional value. Nelson's a natural center, but his speed and goal-scoring should translate to the wing if the need ever arose. With Eriksson Ek and Rossi in-house and prospects like Danila Yurov, Riley Heidt, and Charlie Stramel on the way, a Wild team with Nelson would have the flexibility to put their three best centers in the middle while still having spots for the remaining players on the wing.

    Boeser would hamper that kind of flexibility. If Yurov or Heidt can't hold down the pivot, or if Stramel can't make an NHL top-nine, the move would be to shift them to the wing. But if Boeser, Kaprizov, and Matt Boldy are all high-scoring, big-money wingers, that leaves just one top-six winger position available. Should the Wild want to pay top-dollar for a free-agent winger if it means shutting Yurov, Heidt, or Liam Öhgren of an opportunity to make an impact?

    Ultimately, neither player comes without major upside and risk. The best move could be to keep building internally or target players from other organizations, similar to how the Wild landed David Jiricek.

    It'd also maybe be nice for the Wild to be able to realistically be able to attract a free agent that wasn't born within a six-hour drive of Minnesota. But as counterintuitive as it may sound to go with an older player in free agency, if the Wild end up having to choose between the two Brocks, Nelson seems like the player that makes more sense, and Boeser may be just a bit too risky for the Wild to pursue at all.

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    The money the Wild have after signing Kaprizov and Rossi to extensions will tell the tale.  I shudder to think spending another $7-8m on either of the Brocks if they have defensive liability.  If you can get Nelson for a little cheaper, he at least has that coveted positional flexibility.

    Edited by Citizen Strife
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    18 minutes ago, Dango said:

    I have a feeling Rantanen is going get 12 mill  but im no expert on those things.

    I don't think he is signing for less than 14M. Essentially the same player as Dre and a year younger. If the wild can get him for 12m, jump with both feet.

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    Boeser is a hard pass for me.

    Nelson I’m not sure. Lots of money tied up to an older player but his size and speed and offense would maybe pay off for Wild

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    2 hours ago, Citizen Strife said:

    The money the Wild have after signing Kaprizov and Rossi to extensions will tell the tale.  I shudder to think spending another $7-8m on either of the Brocks if they have defensive liability.  If you can get Nelson for a little cheaper, he at least has that coveted positional flexibility.

    Rossi is the only one you have to worry about.  The cap goes up this year and predicted to go up next year.  Zucarello and Bogo come off the books, so there is money next summer to give all the money to Kaprizov.  After all he already makes 9 million.  Adding the 4.5 million from the two contracts that are expiring will put him at 13.5.  If the cap goes up 2 million then 15.5.  I doubt they will pay that much for him but who knows.   

    With the Cap going up this year and the dead money they have available they can sign Rossi to 7 to 7.5 and still go for and elite player like Marner or Rantanen.  

    The gloom and doom reports that they have to sign a bunch of people this off season and not having the money after the Kaprizov extension is just not the case.  

    Marat and Rossi are the only ones they need to sign and Marat might be traded to make room for Yurov.  I wouldn't like that because I like what Marat does.  

    Next year the roster is going to be surprisingly young in comparison to this year.  Ohgren, Yurov, Buium, Jiricek and Wallstedt will be on the roster.  All making ELC.  Riley Hiedt and Hunter Haight will be knocking on the door from Iowa and Kalem Parker will probably be in the mix.

    So, there is a lot of money to toss to someone who is due to make a lot of money.  They better use that money to buy something young and shiny.  Brock Nelson and Brock Boeser are neither young or shiny. 

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    say no to any more minnesotans just because they are from Minnesota. make a criteria that a player is actually a good fit. neither one of the other brocks is. and they will command around 8 per? yuck

    here is our "locked" top 6 for next year - where do we have an open spot? I am giving Yurov a top 6 spot - cause it seems destiny.

    EK YUROV KAPRIZOV BOLDY ZUCCY ROSSI

    without a trade - who do we bump down? i think i'd maybe bump Ek to 3rd and toss out Freddy? Then look to fill in Ek's vacant spot. That should go to a physical player - reality we need one in our top 6 and it won't be Boeser and Nelson.  So i think my top 3 to fill that is Miller (i'd still send Ek for him), Tuch (no core piece dealt) and Rantannen (next year wish list.....HA). I know I know....especially with Ranty it's a lot - but just imagine if we pluck him away from Avs.....about due....right? 

     

     

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    1 hour ago, TCMooch said:

    Boeser is a hard pass for me.

    Nelson I’m not sure. Lots of money tied up to an older player but his size and speed and offense would maybe pay off for Wild

    yup - i am w ya - little skeptical that this is going to hold true for Nelson as he enters his 34+ year of existence - (let's just be on the safe side and pass)

    His bursts above 20 mph rank him among the NHL's best

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    2 hours ago, 1Brotherbill said:

    Rossi is the only one you have to worry about.  The cap goes up this year and predicted to go up next year.  Zucarello and Bogo come off the books, so there is money next summer to give all the money to Kaprizov.  After all he already makes 9 million.  Adding the 4.5 million from the two contracts that are expiring will put him at 13.5.  If the cap goes up 2 million then 15.5.  I doubt they will pay that much for him but who knows.   

    With the Cap going up this year and the dead money they have available they can sign Rossi to 7 to 7.5 and still go for and elite player like Marner or Rantanen.  

    The gloom and doom reports that they have to sign a bunch of people this off season and not having the money after the Kaprizov extension is just not the case.  

    Marat and Rossi are the only ones they need to sign and Marat might be traded to make room for Yurov.  I wouldn't like that because I like what Marat does.  

    Next year the roster is going to be surprisingly young in comparison to this year.  Ohgren, Yurov, Buium, Jiricek and Wallstedt will be on the roster.  All making ELC.  Riley Hiedt and Hunter Haight will be knocking on the door from Iowa and Kalem Parker will probably be in the mix.

    So, there is a lot of money to toss to someone who is due to make a lot of money.  They better use that money to buy something young and shiny.  Brock Nelson and Brock Boeser are neither young or shiny. 

    Wallstedt will be done with his ELC. I think it's 2.2 or so per yr staring next yr.

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    I have a huge problem with Boeser at 8M+.

    His career average has been 31 goals and 67 points in 82 games. If he was regularly posting these numbers, sure, it would be great, I wouldn't mind paying well for that.

    But he doesn't.

    Not counting 2016/17 where je played 9 games, he's played 509 games out of possible 584 games. He never plays a full season.

    I'm all for going for Boeser, but not for more than Boldy money and term.

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    Absolutely no to Boeser at any cost.  Doesn’t play physical and is a floater player. 

    Dont trade for Nelson this year unless it’s for a future 3rd round pick or later.  If you want to sign him next year don’t pay over $3.5m per year with no protection. 

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    12 hours ago, OldDutchChip said:

    yup - i am w ya - little skeptical that this is going to hold true for Nelson as he enters his 34+ year of existence - (let's just be on the safe side and pass)

    His bursts above 20 mph rank him among the NHL's best

    Same, it's not a bet I'd love making. But if you take care of your body and don't get injured (two big ifs), top players can keep their speed into their 40s. Matt Cullen was still pretty fast at the end. 

    (I wanted to make this point in the article, but the computer ate half of my piece and I had to scramble back).

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    16 hours ago, Citizen Strife said:

    I shudder to think spending another $7-8m on either of the Brocks if they have defensive liability.

    Well, Johansson is a significant defensive liability without the offense, so Brock Nelson on that line with JEE and Boldy would help a lot, but I certainly would prefer him at $5M, so if he can give a MN discount, I'd happily welcome him in.

    Edited by Imyourhuckleberry
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    12 minutes ago, Tony Abbott said:

    Same, it's not a bet I'd love making. But if you take care of your body and don't get injured (two big ifs), top players can keep their speed into their 40s. Matt Cullen was still pretty fast at the end. 

    (I wanted to make this point in the article, but the computer ate half of my piece and I had to scramble back).

    yeap makes sense. for some reason i keep thinking nelson had some big injuries (esp to the head), but maybe i'm thinking of another - perhaps larkin - i get em confused.

    where do you and everyone envision nelson playing next year if we get him? (if we get him this year - he's likely to be signed for few more....) 

    Kap Zuccy Ek Yurov Boldy Rossi (potential FA) Nelson Ohgren - all would want to be top6.... do we pay nelson more than 4MM if he becomes our bottom 6? can he do it in his down years? i would be more excited to get someone like yanni gourde - who is much better fitted for the role that we have for him. him/harty/trenin or foligno would be a good 3rd....

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    I think the goal is to make a top-9, not a top-6/bottom-6.

    I'd probably explore putting him on Line 2 and moving Eriksson Ek to Line 3, with the option to move Ek back up to defend in crunch time. Like the idea of Boldy as support for Nelson both defensively and from a playmaking winger perspective.

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    I would look at this a little bit differently. The fist line should be Kaprisov-Ek-Boldy. We have solid third and fourth lines. Marat need to signed he is getting better and when he stop being afraid of making mistakes and use his skills he will be even better. So Wild needs to concentrate on the second line only. Does Rossi-Yurov-Ogaden-Zuccarello (and upcoming young players) good enough? If yes wait one more year. If not change something here. I like Alex Touch 

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    I had no idea that Boesser was a below average skater. I suspected his defense wasn't strong, and he wasn't going to be a big hitter, but 40 goals at age 26 seemed very appealing. I now understand the pushback received when mentioning him. I don't think he would give the Wild enough of a deal on a contract to make it worth bringing him in based upon what's mentioned above.

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    On Russo and Tony Pants' podcast (Worst Seat In The House) that dropped yesterday, Russo said nonchalantly the Wild will sign Nelson this offseason. He said it in a way that made me replay it a couple times. 😳

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