Article: Faber's Challenge: Fill Dumba's Skates and Follow Brodin's Footsteps

[Tony Abbott]

View full article

[TCMooch]

Hey man, no pressure!

[vonlonster67]

Every day another young gun profiled for the Minnesota Wild. If you cant get excited for our future then you aren't from the State of Hockey. 

Ironic I just stopped at "The Lodge" today to get my "Faber on and get ready for the future.

Tony, I know Brock is still a young man, but he grounded, and a natural leader at every level he's played. He's another Minnesota stud that comes from a blue collar up bringing, with a solid base family and a work ethic and hockey sense.

We may see some bumps along the way and we don't need to put undue pressure on Faber, however I'm sure he'd be the first to tell you to "bring it on"! What I've seen from him is with the Gophers, USNDT and the USA National Stage is he's mature, willing to lead with elite talent surrounding him, accept critique and never makes mistakes repeatedly. His growth in the next three years will provide us with a top pair with what we have coming up in Hunt, Lambos, Spacek and Masters and maybe O'Rourke or Johansson.

I get pumped thinking what is going on right now on the ice at our practice facility and in the weight room with Boldy, Rossi, Walker Faber, and Addison as the younger group meshes and develops chemistry before the season.

Bring us "more" Tony, the season is a ways out and we need some "more"!

[bisopher]

Two things I want to highlight:

1- How good an all-around player was Bergeron, with that level of defensive prowess as a forward?  Looks like he earned those six Selkes.

2- Fully agree that Brodin-Faber can be an elite defensive pairing, hopefully for a number of years.  That said, I'm warming to NHL.com's prediction that Addison pairs with Brodin and Faber with Goligoski / Merrill.   That would give us three strong pairings, give Addison more support while he learns the "D" part of defense, and save us from the adventure(s) that would ensue with Addison paired with G / M.

[vonlonster67]

25 minutes ago, bisopher said:

2- Fully agree that Brodin-Faber can be an elite defensive pairing, hopefully for a number of years.  That said, I'm warming to NHL.com's prediction that Addison pairs with Brodin and Faber with Goligoski / Merrill.   That would give us three strong pairings, give Addison more support while he learns the "D" part of defense, and save us from the adventure(s) that would ensue with Addison paired with G / M.

I've heard similar rumblings.

The X factor will be Deano. I just wonder if he's willing to sacrifice the elite pairing to protect Addison. They had zero patience with him and I agree it makes sense to go three good pairings, but there is one "BUT".

Remember who Brodin is one the ice against and that tells me probably not. I'm thinking of one match up that comes to mind "McDavid/Draisaitl" Addison on the ice scares the .... out of me. That's was the one memory of this past year every time they match up to see Brodin shut down "McD".

Fill in the blank on every team we face....just a thought. I would rather have Faber on the ice learning on the job. What worries me is I'm not sure Addison is open to critique and an open mind to correct anything like Faber.  Last year tells me that he is not and that is why he sat. If you listen to Billy or Deano you could read between the lines. Listen to what they didn't say. Addison is on very thin ice and I'm thinking he's still not out of the doghouse and could still be traded if a move or salary is an issue.

Thanks for the discussion though, its a good one to ponder!

[Imyourhuckleberry]

1 hour ago, vonlonster67 said:

Remember who Brodin is one the ice against and that tells me probably not. I'm thinking of one match up that comes to mind "McDavid/Draisaitl" Addison on the ice scares the .... out of me. That's was the one memory of this past year every time they match up to see Brodin shut down "McD".

Yeah, I'd put the chances of Addison being paired with Brodin at about zero.

Addison doesn't play PK, and Brodin certainly will be.  It doesn't seem like a great idea to be mixing lines every time you have a full 2-minute penalty kill. Someone is likely going to double-shift and tire out more often than is necessary.  Addison also is only going to play around 11-12 minutes of 5v5 hockey per night, with the rest of his minutes on PP.  Brodin is going to play over 20 minutes.

When you consider the special teams implications and the uneven minutes allocations, I just don't think it makes sense because you'd need to be swapping pairings all night, beyond the situations where coaches need to account for a defenseman in the penalty box.

It seems like unnecessary additional stress to put on coaches and players every game. Doesn't make sense to me putting Brodin with a weak defensive player to nullify his pairings effectiveness against top lines.

[Protec]

I think Addison learned a lot this season. Getting too big for your britches before becoming indispensable is not great for playing time. His benching also somewhat tanked his trade value so any ideas of holding out or trying to force a trade would more likely make you look like a problem guy league-wide. There's still a lot of potential for him to become a good NHL player but the Wild have the leverage with him. They're gonna expect him to get with the program. I think he's probably got the point by now. I think this year is gonna tell us a lot about Rossi & Addison AND the Wild's development group. Grit-injections are safe and effective and will get Wild prospects through these difficult times as confirmed by facial media influenceers.

[Will D. Ness]

Faber's first shift in the NHL was in the playoffs, a couple days after losing in the championship game, inserted into the lineup without playing with the team really.

Talk about pressure and being set up for failure.

He looked really unsure of himself and shaky in that first shift... but he powered through it all without making a mistake.  By the end of that awful series he was feeling good and looking good and you could tell that he not only belongs in the NHL but might thrive in the NHL.

Addison OTOH, has just one skill.  Efficient puck movement on the PP.  He doesn't have a heavy shot.  He doesn't have great playmaking ability on the blue line.  He doesn't move the puck out of the zone all that great, and to top it off, he is the worst defender on the team by quite a margin.

He deserves another shot, but with a tighter leash than Rossi even.  If we see this aloof and apathetic speed bump of a defenseman again then trade him for whatever.

 

 

[mnfaninnc]

11 hours ago, vonlonster67 said:

They had zero patience with him and I agree it makes sense to go three good pairings, but there is one "BUT".

I have to disagree with this line, I thought they had a lot of patience with Addison. They continually told him he needed to defend, he needed to cancel out bodies, he needed to engage in his own end, and Addison continued to blow them off and not do it. There's a difference between trying and failing, but when a player looks disinterested in that aspect, the Wild coaches were right to pull him off the ice. 

When he was interviewed by the media, you could tell he wasn't on the same page, and by stating he just needs to keep doing what he's been doing, it showed he really didn't get it. Change is what was needed, not the same thing.

They gave Addison 3/4 of a season to figure it out, and he couldn't. Part of it may have been that defense was never demanded in his earlier years, his offense was good enough to overlook the defense. Not now! Addison stayed in MN to work this offseason. He needs to look ripped upper body coming into camp and have a whole new attitude. If it's not there, I'm betting he gets traded pretty promptly. 

As for a Brodin-Faber pairing, I can see that in selected games and 3rd period leads. But, overall, having 3 strong pairings is the way to go.....for 2 periods. 

Watching Faber with the Gophers (and I only saw the NCAA tournament), one thing that stood out was that Faber claimed about 60% of the ice, and his partner only had to cover about 40%. I don't know if this will mesh with Brodin all that well, as I think he is able to do the same thing. But, you could play with the pairings. Down the stretch, you could put Spurgeon-Brodin and Faber Middleton on the ice.

 

[mnfaninnc]

As we have seen, Dumba is still unsigned. I wrote on another thread it is highly unlikely that he comes back, but, it would be in his best interest to sign a low budget 1 year deal and try to take advantage of a higher cap in '24. 

With Faber being waiverproof, he could start in Iowa if Dumba were to maybe resign a 1 year $1m contract to come back for one more try. I'm pretty sure you could move Merrill, but it might take a few weeks. This also gives Addison a make or break opportunity to show he has grown. If he hasn't, he may be the one shopped instead. 

Dumba is a top 4 talent and could help the team. It would be extremely short term, likely as long as it takes Lambos to acclimate himself. Faber would then start in Iowa and be called up when the dust has cleared. It would have been easier for the team had Goligoski seen the writing on the wall and simply retired this offseason. It was fairly obvious that his skills had downgraded significantly and it has been time. Of course, the player is usually the last to know.

Transition is always a tricky thing. Evason has to live in the present and put in the best lineup to win. Guerin is thinking about the future and some of this experience might be really valuable, but both Addison and Faber need ice time. When to do it is the key question. What if Addison has a fabulous training camp? What if Faber also does? What if Goligoski or Merrill don't look very good? There's a lot of questions here, and some players with full NMCs. 

For me, I think Dumba's choices will be here or AZ. He'd get a little more money in AZ, but he also may look far worse. If his hope is to get one last nice contract, here is the best place for him as a player, and he's got to win the bet on himself. 

[vonlonster67]

1 hour ago, mnfaninnc said:

I have to disagree with this line, I thought they had a lot of patience with Addison. They continually told him he needed to defend, he needed to cancel out bodies, he needed to engage in his own end, and Addison continued to blow them off and not do it. There's a difference between trying and failing, but when a player looks disinterested in that aspect, the Wild coaches were right to pull him off the ice. 

When he was interviewed by the media, you could tell he wasn't on the same page, and by stating he just needs to keep doing what he's been doing, it showed he really didn't get it. Change is what was needed, not the same thing.

They gave Addison 3/4 of a season to figure it out, and he couldn't. Part of it may have been that defense was never demanded in his earlier years, his offense was good enough to overlook the defense. Not now! Addison stayed in MN to work this offseason. He needs to look ripped upper body coming into camp and have a whole new attitude. If it's not there, I'm betting he gets traded pretty promptly. 

As for a Brodin-Faber pairing, I can see that in selected games and 3rd period leads. But, overall, having 3 strong pairings is the way to go.....for 2 periods. 

Watching Faber with the Gophers (and I only saw the NCAA tournament), one thing that stood out was that Faber claimed about 60% of the ice, and his partner only had to cover about 40%. I don't know if this will mesh with Brodin all that well, as I think he is able to do the same thing. But, you could play with the pairings. Down the stretch, you could put Spurgeon-Brodin and Faber Middleton on the ice.

 

I'll clarify for you. Zero patience arose after his "tude" that was apparent by everyone watching. He's a stop gap n if they find someone else they'll cut their losses

I disagree with your theory on Dumba, he's gone. Dumba of yesteryear is gone. Time to move on from the liability. He played two good months this past year when it was too late and money was on the line

 

You need to watch some more Faber film

 

 

[Will D. Ness]

2 hours ago, mnfaninnc said:

Down the stretch, you could put Spurgeon-Brodin and Faber Middleton on the ice.

I would really like to see how these pairings work out.

[bisopher]

14 hours ago, Imyourhuckleberry said:

Yeah, I'd put the chances of Addison being paired with Brodin at about zero.

Addison doesn't play PK, and Brodin certainly will be.  It doesn't seem like a great idea to be mixing lines every time you have a full 2-minute penalty kill. Someone is likely going to double-shift and tire out more often than is necessary.  Addison also is only going to play around 11-12 minutes of 5v5 hockey per night, with the rest of his minutes on PP.  Brodin is going to play over 20 minutes.

This, along with the picture of Addison on the ice against McDavid / Draisaitl or any of a number of elite scoring lines, now has me fully convinced that Addison will be on the 3rd D pairing (as he was in Iowa, BTW) and PP only for the foreseeable future.  Brodin's (and Spurgeon's, for that matter) opportunities to teach Addison the right way(s) to play solid Defense will come in practice, not at game time.

[Protec]

I agree and think Addison getting half an NHL season last year was fine. It was a hard look as some have called it around here. He just wasn't good enough defensively for the home stretch or the playoffs. I think he'll get a full season for the most part as long as he can show some improvement in his own zone and around the net. You'd think he'll be better defensively due to the message he received and off-season work. He's not as much a pure-project but a player with some purification needed. Offensively his talents are good enough not to write off too early. He might become an even more valuable trade asset if a time comes when he doesn't fit. For now, I don't see anything except him trying to earn a full-time role.

[vonlonster67]

3 hours ago, Protec said:

I agree and think Addison getting half an NHL season last year was fine. It was a hard look as some have called it around here. He just wasn't good enough defensively for the home stretch or the playoffs. I think he'll get a full season for the most part as long as he can show some improvement in his own zone and around the net. You'd think he'll be better defensively due to the message he received and off-season work. He's not as much a pure-project but a player with some purification needed. Offensively his talents are good enough not to write off too early. He might become an even more valuable trade asset if a time comes when he doesn't fit. For now, I don't see anything except him trying to earn a full-time role.

Protec, I would be willing to keep Addison around in the hope the light bulb goes off with maturity, but I question if he's got the right mindset for our locker room.

Last years reaction tells me that if the coaches are telling him one thing, the vets are also. Still no change to his "D".

I feel he's in no man's land with were he's at and the contract he's gonna get. He'll have to try and make it look good to get to a place he wants to be that he believes will accept him for his "O" and cover his "A"

Thanks again. 

[mnfaninnc]

21 hours ago, vonlonster67 said:

You need to watch some more Faber film

It's all I had access to because I'm too cheap to pay for B1G network or wherever college hockey was being broadcast. I looked for it on ESPN+, but they didn't have the major conferences there.

I did manage to see him in the playoffs, though, and I felt it was similar, he helped handle Klingberg's deficiencies and took over about 60% of the ice. He is one of the solutions of a light RHD squad.

I do value Dumba and always have, but the only way he fits in is on a 1 year deal at about $1m. He needs to jumpstart his offense again, and the Wild really need 1 more year before the cavalry arrives. 

Faber in Iowa would be a very temporary thing, the reason is simple, he's waiver exempt. If we go with this plan, we have 8 NHL defenders, 1 too many. So, someone would need to go. I do not doubt that Faber will be a very good NHL defender, but as a young guy waivers exempt, sometimes, that's just how it goes. Another option could be sending Merrill to Iowa? 

[mnfaninnc]

19 hours ago, bisopher said:

This, along with the picture of Addison on the ice against McDavid / Draisaitl or any of a number of elite scoring lines, now has me fully convinced that Addison will be on the 3rd D pairing (as he was in Iowa, BTW) and PP only for the foreseeable future.  Brodin's (and Spurgeon's, for that matter) opportunities to teach Addison the right way(s) to play solid Defense will come in practice, not at game time.

I do believe that Brodin-Addison will be a pairing. But, when it comes to the line above and some others, Addison might even be scratched. Deano won't trust him down the stretch, but he might get more time if the Wild are down and need to score. What we may find is that there are no set pairings anymore!

[mnfaninnc]

14 hours ago, vonlonster67 said:

Last years reaction tells me that if the coaches are telling him one thing, the vets are also. Still no change to his "D".

I don't remember hearing anyone from management, coaches, or vets crying that our PP wasn't working in the playoffs because Addison wasn't there. Everyone could see that Kaprizov was fighting it and the big loss there was Ek. 

I do, however, remember people in management, coaching, or vets being amazed at Faber's play!

[vonlonster67]

5 hours ago, mnfaninnc said:

It's all I had access to because I'm too cheap to pay for B1G network or wherever college hockey was being broadcast. I looked for it on ESPN+, but they didn't have the major conferences there.

I did manage to see him in the playoffs, though, and I felt it was similar, he helped handle Klingberg's deficiencies and took over about 60% of the ice. He is one of the solutions of a light RHD squad.

I do value Dumba and always have, but the only way he fits in is on a 1 year deal at about $1m. He needs to jumpstart his offense again, and the Wild really need 1 more year before the cavalry arrives. 

Faber in Iowa would be a very temporary thing, the reason is simple, he's waiver exempt. If we go with this plan, we have 8 NHL defenders, 1 too many. So, someone would need to go. I do not doubt that Faber will be a very good NHL defender, but as a young guy waivers exempt, sometimes, that's just how it goes. Another option could be sending Merrill to Iowa? 

I watch the games on Direct TV, Bally for the Gophers, but you should invest in watching the IA Wild AHL TV, it will be well worth it this year and next. 

CHL for our prospects is outrageous 2fity for a year, but there are games that have been played you can watch for free.

It might be time to invest in BIG10 though considering how many Gophers are now WIld prosects and Stramel in  Sconny!

[Protec]

Faber just needs to practice wristers from the point. Getting em through. Practice that dasher-board, wide of the net shot. Get the forward thinking he's blocking the path of the puck to the net and then intentionally miss him with it so Ek can tip it in while it's going 2-3' wide.

Faber could be the Suter we always wished we had in MN. Not sure it's possible to compare toxic ego and entitlement to modest proof in pudding but if Faber's TOI ever got close to what we'd see for #20 and he can sling a few wristers on goal or perhaps join the rush once in awhile, that'd be how to do it.

From what we've seen, Faber should have no problems defending well and being reliable on all parts of the game with the exception of offensive contribution. I would think that improves over the next couple years. If Faber scores more than 16pts this season you could argue he's better than Suter was. If Faber ever reaches 50pts in his career, he'll be better than Suter was.

What an assbag, Suter. Slower than molasses in January, always dodging accountability, needs maximum TOI, gets doors blown off in OT, wants to make the most money, and now Kaprizov molester guy...