Brock Faber Could Use Some Time to Relax

Faber kind of reminds me of a Joe Mauer. An uber-talented hometown kid who will play his whole career here, because he loves this place. 

I'll give Mikki a little time for rest and relaxation, but, really, what Faber needs is a larger frame. He was big enough to play his position and not get abused like Addison was. He is a great skater like Brodin is, with excellent hockey IQ and stick work. His edges are elite. 

What is missing? Late in the season I could see the struggle to tie someone up behind the net, a larger player. I'll give him credit, he battled. I noticed this also about Chisholm, who, was not as successful. Both of these guys are very young but need, NEED, more strength. 

Sure, you get to have earlier tee times when you miss the playoffs, but, the longer summer also means longer training time. I would allow the body to recover a bit, but for both of these defenders, they have to dedicate themselves to bulking up. As for Faber, there are 2 areas I'd like to see improvement:

1. Coming into the season next year at about 210-215. For large forwards he can be giving up to 30 lbs. away. This cuts that in half. I don't expect him to suddenly turn into Middleton, but I do expect him to be able to handle larger players with more ease. 
2. The slapper. He doesn't really have one, but he does need one. It's time to learn! Getting shot help and being able to put that slapper on net to hit the high corners and also keep it low for tips. He doesn't have to show it off every night, players just need to know he's got that shot in his bag. Currently, his slapper is only feared by Andy, the Pee Wee goaltender in an Edina rec league. This needs to change.

With the exits of the Deweys, and some open space for forwards, this is an important offseason for anyone wanting to claim a spot. Follow Rossi's lead and dedicate yourself to adding 15 lbs. of muscle. Ohgren can help you get there. Ek can help you get there. The results for Rossi were outstanding!

Next on the list is edge work. Working with Andy Ness specifically in this area will likely add some muscle but give any player an advantage next season. Straight line speed is nice, but the way this roster is constructed, edges are going to be one of the most important things. 

If you do not have the size to beat down an opponent, which it does not appear as if we do, one season of bulking up players isn't going to completely change that. However, being able to cut back and forth is not something large bodies and long legs do exceptionally well. Throwing them slightly off balance gives you the advantage when bodies contact. This is the way to beat large imposing defenders. It is also the best way to draw penalties. 

Also, last night was not a good night for us in the WHL.

Both Moose Jaw and Prince George dropped game 2. Series are tied at 1.

I think Faber will relax easier with a cool $70-80m in his bank account.

I’m very impressed with Faber. He has that Charlie Mac. Vibe about him. I agree he be needs to get a little more physical but he will figure that out.  He’s got the work ethic and calm cool demeanor of Ek. I think what’s most impressive about him is his mental strength. No situation was too big for him . He never was in disarray when the rest of the team was this year. He doesn’t do bone headed things out of frustration like our leaders do .   He just doesn’t seem to mentally break or is he fragile like most of the wild players.  He is a stud and his mental toughness makes him a winner 

Faber is steady. We liked that from Suter but he was slower than molasses in January and didn't add much offensively. He was mean and cheated when possible with hacks and cross-checks. That is good but not something Faber does. I would like to see Faber add some 80's-90's Scott Stevens or Chris Pronger to his game, but I'd also like to see Guerin balance the defense pairings so guys can play to their strengths and not have to reinvent themselves. Bogo be Bogo, and Faber/Brodin be the smooth skating puck movers. Middleton is kinda stale and less valuable without Spurgeon. Regaining that balance would be huge.

Dumba has been getting burned like crazy Round 1 series with Tampa. MN needs to keep Chisholm on the path to NHL regular, but the Wild could upgrade from Middleton to Jalen Chatfield, N.Zadorov, Brady Skjei, or Justin Shultz. Another two-way defender that can tack on some scoring from the point without sacrificing defense would be huge for the Wild. If they traded Spurgeon, they'd 100% have the cap to sign guys like that. If they didn't trade Spurge, but instead Middleton or Merrill, they could perhaps still work out the money to improve the depth/scoring or toughness/size on defense.

Hopefully the Brock-Pot can simmer on low all Summer and come out hot for the start of the season. I think he needs a lot of help though and the UFA list has some nice options. I would hate to see other Central teams swoop up these good available players and upgrade while the Wild hold onto their young guys and nostalgia players hoping they become much better versions of themselves. Seems unlikely and UFA upgrades and roster shuffle should be strongly considered. Strongly considered. Consider strongly what MN could do with defense upgrades and Spurgeon money off the books.

Final thought, did MN defense hit anybody this year? Seems like they let speedsters like #29 Colorado burn thru the neutral zone like they was nothing but orange cones in MN jerseys.

48 minutes ago, Protec said:

Faber is steady. We liked that from Suter but he was slower than molasses in January and didn't add much offensively. He was mean and cheated when possible with hacks and cross-checks. That is good but not something Faber does. I would like to see Faber add some 80's-90's Scott Stevens or Chris Pronger to his game, but I'd also like to see Guerin balance the defense pairings so guys can play to their strengths and not have to reinvent themselves. Bogo be Bogo, and Faber/Brodin be the smooth skating puck movers. Middleton is kinda stale and less valuable without Spurgeon. Regaining that balance would be huge.

Dumba has been getting burned like crazy Round 1 series with Tampa. MN needs to keep Chisholm on the path to NHL regular, but the Wild could upgrade from Middleton to Jalen Chatfield, N.Zadorov, Brady Skjei, or Justin Shultz. Another two-way defender that can tack on some scoring from the point without sacrificing defense would be huge for the Wild. If they traded Spurgeon, they'd 100% have the cap to sign guys like that. If they didn't trade Spurge, but instead Middleton or Merrill, they could perhaps still work out the money to improve the depth/scoring or toughness/size on defense.

Hopefully the Brock-Pot can simmer on low all Summer and come out hot for the start of the season. I think he needs a lot of help though and the UFA list has some nice options. I would hate to see other Central teams swoop up these good available players and upgrade while the Wild hold onto their young guys and nostalgia players hoping they become much better versions of themselves. Seems unlikely and UFA upgrades and roster shuffle should be strongly considered. Strongly considered. Consider strongly what MN could do with defense upgrades and Spurgeon money off the books.

Final thought, did MN defense hit anybody this year? Seems like they let speedsters like #29 Colorado burn thru the neutral zone like they was nothing but orange cones in MN jerseys

 

• Brock-pot better not simmer too much, we need his ribs tough and gristly.  Those ribs better not get tender, otherwise this team is cooked.

• It appears that Foligno (177 hits), who only played 55 games and was out suffering through a 'core muscle' injury was the teams hits leader.  Middleton led the D with 148 hits through a full 80 games.  Bogo wasnt far behind with 105 through 61 games.  That said, I cant seem to think of a game where Midsy/Bogo intimidated anybody. 

• Merrill trade?  Lol, in what universe does that happen, have you seen him play?  If you have a better option, send him to Iowa, and you can bury damn near his entire contract there.

• I can't believe I'm saying this, but this season made me miss Dumba.  A guy who was a damn wild card willing to destroy a guy in order to try to turn the tide in a game.  Not sure if last season we saw an intentionally muzzled Foligno/Hartzy as they needed to rebuild their reputations with the zebras, but nobody last season seemed willing to throw their body around to set the fucking tone. 
• That goes for all our AHL callups too...not sure why guys given the chance to play with the big club were afraid to get physical.  You got Ek throwing 2.2 hits/game, but Lucchini (0.58 hits/game) Letteri (1.1 hits/game) and Beckman (1.2) cant get hungry to take that puck away?

1 hour ago, MrCheatachu said:

• Brock-pot better not simmer too much, we need his ribs tough and gristly.  Those ribs better not get tender, otherwise this team is cooked.

 

• It appears that Foligno (177 hits), who only played 55 games and was out suffering through a 'core muscle' injury was the teams hits leader.  Middleton led the D with 148 hits through a full 80 games.  Bogo wasnt far behind with 105 through 61 games.  That said, I cant seem to think of a game where Midsy/Bogo intimidated anybody. 

 

• Merrill trade?  Lol, in what universe does that happen, have you seen him play?  If you have a better option, send him to Iowa, and you can bury damn near his entire contract there.

 

• I can't believe I'm saying this, but this season made me miss Dumba.  A guy who was a damn wild card willing to destroy a guy in order to try to turn the tide in a game.  Not sure if last season we saw an intentionally muzzled Foligno/Hartzy as they needed to rebuild their reputations with the zebras, but nobody last season seemed willing to throw their body around to set the fucking tone. 
• That goes for all our AHL callups too...not sure why guys given the chance to play with the big club were afraid to get physical.  You got Ek throwing 2.2 hits/game, but Lucchini (0.58 hits/game) Letteri (1.1 hits/game) and Beckman (1.2) cant get hungry to take that puck away?

You're right that it wasn't nothing. I guess, I'm thinking of noteworthy or meaningful hits. The kind that really do something to make an impact on the game. When forwards play the body and separate the man from the puck, it often leads to offense. The GREEF line was a perfect example. That's gone in MN. I posted the Chatfield clip because that's what Dumba used to do. It doesn't have to be an open-ice crusher hit but MN needs to have more of a have physicality presence. Not that it's needed all the time, but where's the Prosser or Seeler of the past? Bogo, and Middleton are okay, but not nearly to the extent that MN had with Suter, Prosser, Seeler, Dumba, Soucy, and players like that who were quick to respond or that you needed to watch out for. Addison was never gonna work if he didn't mimic Spurgeon but even Spurgeon wasn't dominant in the last series loss to Dallas. 

For me the writing is on the wall. MN has to build up their defense by a couple notches. Otherwise Faber is gonna start to feel like Kaprizov and wonder, "why am I doing this solo?"

6mm a year tops for Faber.  Still needs to prove more against top teams.  Got beat to often against Avs and Stars and pushed around in corners by bigger teams.  Don’t rush to overpay someone like we always do.  Do 3-4 years at 6mm and if he improves sign him for more then, he is not worth 8-9mm until he can provide what Makar can and it’s not even close yet.  
 

Also Spurgeon and Middleton need to be moved and we need 2-3 more large skilled dmen on our team.  Watch the playoffs we need more large trees on D.  Also forward group needs a big revamp starting with Rossi, Freddie, Nojo and Zucc if you can convince him to wave no trade clause. Gus also moved.  Big changes needed.
 

Absolutely no to dumba.  He has been terrible in playoffs and we need more.  
 

So many people need to stop being attached to the players and realize what they need to win a Cup.  Change starts now and Billy needs the stones to do it.  

8 hours ago, mnhockeyfan03 said:

So many people need to stop being attached to the players and realize what they need to win a Cup.  Change starts now and Billy needs the stones to do it.  

Yes, exactly.

Here's a great example. Last season MN paid Spurgeon, NoJo, and Foligno a combined 12M for ~ 50pts. Brady Skjei by himself had ~ 50pts at 5M. Duh...

If Guerin brings back the same team and hopes they're gonna compete in the Central, forget about it. The more Guerin's eyes go crossed, I think his head injuries are catching up to him. Violent outbursts towards cap gurus and confidence in NoJo tells me the next things are gonna be tripping up stairs and telling us the border is secure. I said it yesterday, but I'm getting ready to apply a "FBG 2024" bumper sticker leading up to November.

Now there's a narrative developing that Kirill is gonna bail if we don't show something. How long can that be on the back burner, all the way through next season??? If that's the case, MN is really gambling that they can still keep him. Getting attached to Kirill is one thing. Ek, okay then... Getting attached to all these other guys is weird. Does anyone think it's strange MN lost to Philly and ends up in an identical spot pretty much despite their disastrous recent GM. Yes injuries and cap penalties, but they got a Cup winning coach who doesn't play lazy-losers like NoJo no matter how much they make or who they are. Torts rags on players who don't show up, but Boldy is golfing two weeks before camp, and Merrill is doing Pride events. WTF guys, how's MN gonna win anything when the priority is fun-lovin glue guys and Swedes too lazy to shave their neck?

13 hours ago, Protec said:

MN needs to keep Chisholm on the path to NHL regular, but the Wild could upgrade from Middleton to Jalen Chatfield, N.Zadorov, Brady Skjei, or Justin Shultz.

I like the idea of Brady Skjei coming home. Would he want to return? We should find out. Chatfield has had a couple of good years in Carolina, yet, rumor is he's looking for a payday. I'm not quite sure what he thinks he's worth, but he is an RHS

12 hours ago, MrCheatachu said:

I can't believe I'm saying this, but this season made me miss Dumba.  A guy who was a damn wild card willing to destroy a guy in order to try to turn the tide in a game.  Not sure if last season we saw an intentionally muzzled Foligno/Hartzy as they needed to rebuild their reputations with the zebras, but nobody last season seemed willing to throw their body around to set the fucking tone. 

I didn't miss Dumba and was a huge supporter of his while here. My conclusion was that his game was essentially done. What made him so useful was the big hit or the big shot. When it was evident his shot left due to injury, I thought he was more of a liability. 

As for Hartman, early on 2 seasons ago he hurt his right arm in a fight. He still doesn't look right to me. I think he needs to rehab/strengthen that particular area of the body so he can be his normal pest self and actually throw right hands again. Hartman could always back himself up, but it seems he's relegated to just pushing people now. Perhaps he needs something fixed, like a rotator cuff? His game drastically changed with that injury.

2 hours ago, Protec said:

Torts rags on players who don't show up, but Boldy is golfing two weeks before camp, and Merrill is doing Pride events. WTF guys, how's MN gonna win anything when the priority is fun-lovin glue guys and Swedes too lazy to shave their neck?

You know what would go a long way to solving this crisis? Obtaining Brady Tkachuk!

Last night in the O-

Oshawa goes up 2-0, Kumpulainen scores!

Saginaw goes down again and Haight is scoreless. Ritchie is still hurt for Saginaw, a bad time to be hurt.

Faber was a stud, this was year one for full time NHL career and most likely will only keep getting better as he is 21.  The knocks on him not being able to be physical enough could be tied to cracked ribs as well as it not being his game type. We don't know how long he was dealing with that (unless I missed it somewhere).  I agree he could add muscle but he is only 21, that will come as he matures.

The talk about "look at the trees all these other teams have on defense" I think is, well wrong. Bogo - 6ft 3 231, Brodin 6'2" 196, Chisholm 6'1" 190 faber 6'1" 200, mids 6'3" 219.  Avs have 1 D player at 6'3 218,  3 at 6'1" 191 to 227. Makar is 6'0" 187. 

Really the only one that stood out as "Huge" was vegas.  I think it needs to be more of an attitude vs actual size. Matthew Tkachuk comes to mind. Dude is a menace but shows up as 6'2" 206, Basically NoJo who is 6'1" 203..... yeah, size I don't think is the problem. Its more the style the Wild play and the mentality of individuals. 

What I see more than a size issue, especially with the way todays game is played, is speed. Think Kap when he is moving, Boldy when he gets a little selfish and makes it happen on his own. Shaw flies and is damn physical and disrupts being 5'10" 184, but he is like a little pit-bull. I like moose, brings physicality when healthy but is slower, Zuc is skillful but doesn't have the speed anymore either. When the cap hits come off, the vets start falling off the roster we will see more speed with the young guys coming in. That's what the drafts seem to have been. A few larger guys to plant in front of the net but speed and hands for days.  Trees can get in the way but also can get skated around. See what MacKinnon and McDavid and Kap (Yes, world class, some of the best playing the game) do to these trees, leave them rooted in place.

In short strength is very important because it will provide you leverage and angles. Everyone wants a 6ft 4in 230 super Mario, but there is a reason he is an all time great.  Get speed and skill, adjust the definition of "Grit" to more of a pain in the ass, grind you down instead of a blow you up biggest hitting team since the broad street bullies. At times the pinning and leaning on players, much like in a fight, will drain their legs. Be like Ek, a pest more than a bully. But that's how I would want to build a team, speed, skill and annoying as hell with a grinding in your face mentality. 

38 minutes ago, mnfaninnc said:

I didn't miss Dumba and was a huge supporter of his while here. My conclusion was that his game was essentially done. What made him so useful was the big hit or the big shot. When it was evident his shot left due to injury, I thought he was more of a liability.

I think I missed the energy he brought. Was more often than not a liability on defense, had lost his scary slap shot but think he brought the energy and occasional reckless abandoned that is fun to watch but left him open to being burned. But, damn, when it landed (see Pavelski hit), was electric and amazing, that is what I miss, those oh damn moments.

33 minutes ago, IllicitFive said:

Really the only one that stood out as "Huge" was vegas.  I think it needs to be more of an attitude vs actual size. Matthew Tkachuk comes to mind. Dude is a menace but shows up as 6'2" 206, Basically NoJo who is 6'1" 203..... yeah, size I don't think is the problem. Its more the style the Wild play and the mentality of individuals. 

This is precisely why I want to target Brady Tkachuk.

31 minutes ago, IllicitFive said:

I think I missed the energy he brought. Was more often than not a liability on defense, had lost his scary slap shot but think he brought the energy and occasional reckless abandoned that is fun to watch but left him open to being burned. But, damn, when it landed (see Pavelski hit), was electric and amazing, that is what I miss, those oh damn moments.

It seemed like we had that in Middleton when he came over, but since he was our only defender with muscle, his hitting game got kind of conservative. Now that we have another in Bogosian, I thought Middleton would be free to hit, but he did very little of the "set people up and then blow them up." I'd like for him to get that edge back!

One thing I think we're missing on this team is the ability to have that "heavy" shift. The one that sets or changes momentum. That is what Tkachuk can bring...along with great scoring (either Tkachuk, it doesn't matter). 

Sometimes, players respond when there is noise in the building. Heavy shifts can create that noise. A real good fight can do the same, but a heavy shift, I think, can do it just as well. Our problem is that we cannot do this currently without messing up all lines.

My suggestion would be, start games out with Ogie-Ek-Foligno. Their focus is hitting anything that moves. Defenders could be Middleton and Bogosian. You're not trying to score on this line, you are trying to get the crowd into the game and beat down the opponent. This line could be used when you need a lift also. I cannot see it being used more than 3 times a game. You follow it Boldy-Kaprizov-Rossi, and then you reset your lines. Faber and Brodin would be the defensive pair on this line. 

The biggest issue here is that Ek is our #1C currently. So, having to put him on a "blow them up" line messes things up. We need another large center who can do this. Could Ogie-Hartman-Foligno get it done? Maybe, but Hartman is under 200 lbs. so his impact will be less. I do like Foligno and Ogie paired with Dino as a line. Ogie and Dino have chemistry, and Foligno can help Ogie turn into a power forward. 

Just now, mnfaninnc said:

This is precisely why I want to target Brady Tkachuk.

I would love to get him too, the question is what would you be willing to give up, especially for a player like him at 7 years 8 mil+. The sens shot down all talk about trading him before, so one has to imagine it would take a massive deal to get him. I just worry we start gutting high end talent and cap space limiting what can be done in the future. It takes two to tango, assuming Boldy, faber, Kap and ek are untouchable I don't know what they wild could or should give up that would entice the sens to part with him. Its like asking what would it take to pry one the untouchables from the wild roster, or a pasta from the bruins, or makar off the avs. Nice to have but don't know if even a remote possibility. But his mentality is exactly what I would wish to find.

3 minutes ago, mnfaninnc said:

The biggest issue here is that Ek is our #1C currently. So, having to put him on a "blow them up" line messes things up. We need another large center who can do this. Could Ogie-Hartman-Foligno get it done? Maybe, but Hartman is under 200 lbs. so his impact will be less. I do like Foligno and Ogie paired with Dino as a line. Ogie and Dino have chemistry, and Foligno can help Ogie turn into a power forward. 

Hartmann could, I mean Dumba did at 181 lbs, but Hartmann also has a rep that gets him in trouble.  The ogie - hartman - moose line could maybe be that line, not a blow up line, but a bit like the greef line, just shuts you down, adds some scoring. Switch Dino for hartman I am a bigger fan of. Dino has speed, and is a pest which I love, if Ogie can learn from Moose to be a power forward with a better shot that could be a fun line.

9 minutes ago, IllicitFive said:

The sens shot down all talk about trading him before, so one has to imagine it would take a massive deal to get him.

The Sens are now under new management and new ownership and looking for a new coach. It might be the right time. 

2 hours ago, mnfaninnc said:

I like the idea of Brady Skjei coming home. Would he want to return? We should find out. Chatfield has had a couple of good years in Carolina, yet, rumor is he's looking for a payday. I'm not quite sure what he thinks he's worth, but he is an RHS

Just saying, we're sitting here hoping 7M Spurgeon will come back 100% and is the missing link to elite defense, but at the same time there's guys who cost a fraction like Chatfield, or a larger version of Spurge like B.Skjei. 

Even if Chatfield got a healthy raise, we're looking at like 2.5-3M at the top end. Just saying MN has a lot of holes to fill. I have my doubts Guerin will go get any of the guys we mention but the point doesn't change which is that the Wild could easily upgrade via free agency. If they traded players and rustled-up the roster perhaps they can return to their previous trajectory that got derailed in the last 9 months.

This Kirill narrative developing kinda makes it seem necessary.

1 hour ago, mnfaninnc said:

This is precisely why I want to target Brady Tkachuk.

I don’t know if anyone has thought of this but we should get mcdavid too while we’re at it

5 hours ago, Protec said:

but I'm getting ready to apply a "FBG 2024" bumper sticker leading up to November.

Guerin is at risk of losing his biggest defender on this board.  Shit is getting real.

The GMBG NoJo double-down is a tough pill to swallow.

For the Wild's sake I hope he's right and there's a bounceback but I can't see it happening. If he started shaving the neck-beard, that might be a positive indicator.

On the bright side, I can reuse and develop more NoJo memes over the course of the next year. I can also look forward to potentially getting WAY more negative and bringing back the crumudgeoniest parts of my personality. That would bring my career on HW.com full circle. Might not be rolling with the same exact username(due to unfortunate eliminations) but it would connect the comments I was making about getting Suter and Parise in free agency over a decade ago to the hope for future success with the Russian prospect who shall not be named to Guerin's arrival. Now it's turning into disbelief and souring grapes a little bit like deja vu. The penalties are real, but so are the Guerin-goofs. Gus, NoJo, Fred, and Foligno valuations are not good. I see how it happened and most would've agreed last Summer signing Gus wasn't horrendous. NoJo and Fred had just finished nice seasons so I get it. I always say though, better one year too early than one year too late. We'll see I guess whether that's true and GMBG gets burned or not. I have the least faith in NoJo compared to the other three guys, but they're all too expensive based on this most recent season's results.

😃

1 hour ago, Pewterschmidt said:

I don’t know if anyone has thought of this but we should get mcdavid too while we’re at it

If we traded Spurgeon, Rossi, a 1st in 2025, and lets say a prospect like Firstov maybe you could get the younger Tkachuk? Otherwise keep Rossi and give em Boldy.

Florida wasn't shit til they got a Tkachuk so I'd overpay and the only guys I wouldn't trade is Ek, #97, or Faber.