Article: The Marco Rossi Madness Has To End

[Protec]

It has been one of the weirdest situations in recent Wild history. 

It's size, speed, and mean-streak that Rossi lacks. 

He's also one of the best offensive guys who can score clutch goals and he's young. 

No matter what happens, there is some valid points on his cost or replacementability which isn't any guarantee. When I look at Fred or NoJo who are not nasty players with size or great speed either, it makes ya wonder. 

The Wild have created this drama and uncertainty. It's cultivated a curious conundrum to contemplate, and one that likely causes Rossi to sour on MN.

Guerin has played hardball or screwed guys before in one way or another. Staal, Talbot, 11 & 20, or perhaps Bjugstad when there wasn't an obvious solution. To me, it seems like the player Rossi is, and the cost to extend him is the crux of it all. The only thing that makes sense is, the front office wants the money available for something else and to open a center spot for another player. Like they decided it already and it's a foregone conclusion that he's a good trade asset to be used for that purpose. Not fair to Rossi or well-liked by fans but part of the overall plan somehow. 

[OldDutchChip]

3 minutes ago, joebou15 said:

I want to win a Stanley Cup! And leaving a player that has scored 24 goals and 60 points over the 82 game regular season in lieu for guys that haven't offered that kind of stat line is the head scratcher.

The Wild needed 1 of 2 things to win Game 4. They needed a great 3rd period, but we're out-scored 2-1 in the frame. Just one more goal could have ended it. Or, fresh legs in OT. Hynes shortened his bench and leaned on guys that already played 25 minutes in the game against a team that had it's stars playing significantly fewer minutes. 

What Hynes did was cut his nose to spite his face. He had tired legs, and kept a player that could have spot in a few times throughout the 3rd period or OT and provided a jump, and some goal scoring skill on the bench.

So when you ask us, "what do you want?" I want to fucking win. And these decisions are not what winning organizations do. 

i too want to win, as i think the coach too. and he didn't bench Rossi, but he placed him on a line that he deserved.  Rossi went into a funk towards the end of the season. And that continued into the playoffs. Hartman was flat out better in every hockey category and he earned the promotion. And Rossi earned the demotion. Simple as that. This was the right call made by the coach to ensure that he gave his team the best chance to win. Rossi cumulative stats are nicer looking that Hartman but i am not sure anyone can say that Rossi deserves more time than Hartman. Or is that what you are trying to say? Do you want to place Hartman on L4 and move poor Rossi back to 2nd line? or maybe 1st? 

i'll say this again - balance is good. it's great in the playoffs when scoring gets much harder. if rossi's line can deliver - that would be amazing for us. him and trenin can exploit the easier matchups and provide the depth scoring that we need. 

[OldDutchChip]

8 minutes ago, Protec said:

It has been one of the weirdest situations in recent Wild history. 

It's size, speed, and mean-streak that Rossi lacks. 

He's also one of the best offensive guys who can score clutch goals and he's young. 

No matter what happens, there is some valid points on his cost or replacementability which isn't any guarantee. When I look at Fred or NoJo who are not nasty players with size or great speed either, it makes ya wonder. 

The Wild have created this drama and uncertainty. It's cultivated a curious conundrum to contemplate, and one that likely causes Rossi to sour on MN.

Guerin has played hardball or screwed guys before in one way or another. Staal, Talbot, 11 & 20, or perhaps Bjugstad when there wasn't an obvious solution. To me, it seems like the player Rossi is, and the cost to extend him is the crux of it all. The only thing that makes sense is, the front office wants the money available for something else and to open a center spot for another player. Like they decided it already and it's a foregone conclusion that he's a good trade asset to be used for that purpose. Not fair to Rossi or well-liked by fans but part of the overall plan somehow. 

It's size, speed, and mean-streak that Rossi lacks.  100%

we need the above in our top 6. rossi has NOTHING of that. and therefore is not signed. 

[SkolWild73]

29 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

i agree with that thinking and money seems fine, but i do also understand the hesitation from billy. and i think you are a bit low with projections - rossi's camp knows the cap is rising and they can leverage stats to back up his claim to 9 million. yes that high. and he is NOT worth that. maybe sharks or hawks bite on him and offer sheet him? we get picks and use them for trade or use Rossi for trade? regardless - i do think this is Rossi's last year with us 

They really can’t leverage much if he isn’t offered more from another team.  He either signs with us or sits.  They can request a trade, but we would be under no obligation to do so.   Hopefully it does not come to that.

[Citizen Strife]

So what is the solution?  If they are so convinced in Ohgren and Yurov over Rossi, it seems strange you can't just have all three.  After all, Rossi has 63 points this season.  Yurov has 0.  Other players from other teams also have 0 for this team and this system.  

For all we know, Yurov could be an AHL level player, a 20-pt, 30-pt, 60-pt, or 100-pt player.  All because Yurov has a few inches on a guy.  If the money is meant for Gus or Buium, only Gus has the proof of that worth.  We "know" Rossi had 100 points in two seasons.  We still don't know what we have in the two "next guys."

Ek is a guy who gets beaten to shit on a yearly basis.  There has to be a fallback option that isn't Hartman or Gaudreau.  

[Pewterschmidt]

46 minutes ago, joebou15 said:

So when you ask us, "what do you want?" I want to fucking win.

Time to nut up or shut up

[OldDutchChip]

22 minutes ago, SkolWild73 said:

They really can’t leverage much if he isn’t offered more from another team.  He either signs with us or sits.  They can request a trade, but we would be under no obligation to do so.   Hopefully it does not come to that.

right, i mean what if hawks or sharks offer him 8.5 or 9. i think hawks scenario is very likely

[SkolWild73]

3 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

right, i mean what if hawks or sharks offer him 8.5 or 9. i think hawks scenario is very likely

Would be ballsy, considering it could be a 2026 pick in the top 3.  I looked back and there have only be 3 players offered more than 6.87; Vanek in 2007, Shea Weber and then Aho in 2019.  All three were matched.  Aho was coming off a year where he was top ten in voting for the Hart.

 

[OldDutchChip]

24 minutes ago, Citizen Strife said:

So what is the solution?  If they are so convinced in Ohgren and Yurov over Rossi, it seems strange you can't just have all three.  After all, Rossi has 63 points this season.  Yurov has 0.  Other players from other teams also have 0 for this team and this system.  

For all we know, Yurov could be an AHL level player, a 20-pt, 30-pt, 60-pt, or 100-pt player.  All because Yurov has a few inches on a guy.  If the money is meant for Gus or Buium, only Gus has the proof of that worth.  We "know" Rossi had 100 points in two seasons.  We still don't know what we have in the two "next guys."

Ek is a guy who gets beaten to shit on a yearly basis.  There has to be a fallback option that isn't Hartman or Gaudreau.  

i think it comes down to how many non-physical players bill wants in top 6. rossi is a top 6 player (regardless of where he is playing now). bill does not see the physicality in him. we've talked about this too a ton - but there is currently zero deterrence in the top 6 (i guess if you want to play foligno there - but i hope we agree that he is not a top 6 guy) so can we really afford to play Boldy, Ek, Rossi, Yurov, Ohgren, Zuccy as our top 6 next year? there has to be at least one 🙂

Ek is not that, neither is Boldy. the rest are easy prey in the PO. we have thus far been lucky and survived vegas - but we want to win, not survive. all top teams are top 6 heavy teams. and play that way. we need at least one player that matches that and preferably on L1 to help Kap. 

would Rossi, Height, mult picks and Trenin 😉 be enough to get BT? 

[OldDutchChip]

2 minutes ago, SkolWild73 said:

Would be ballsy, considering it could be a 2026 pick in the top 3.  I looked back and there have only be 3 players offered more than 6.87; Vanek in 2007, Shea Weber and then Aho in 2019.  All three were matched.  Aho was coming off a year where he was top ten in voting for the Hart.

 

would you match 9 per on Rossi? i don't think you do that.

[Citizen Strife]

The same Brady as Ottawa's "guy" that Rossi has the same points as while being a 4th liner.  Sure.  I'm so convinced Ottawa wants to get rid of him when they JUST made the playoffs for the first time in years.  For all we know, Brady wants to stay and will stay regardless of the offer.

We're not here saying Rossi at $6.5-$7.5m for 2-3 years is Elias Petterson at $11.6m for 8 years doing 45 points.  We're saying, "Here's some money to not be Dylan Cozens and drop off.  Now prove it before Yurov does it for free like you did."  

If Yurov or some free agent center is the guy, have them beat Rossi in production and force him off that way.  You can't tell me Mojo, Nyquist, Freddy, Hartman, etc. in their 30s have the upside Rossi has.  Rossi has more points than all those except Hartman...so what the fuck else does he need to do?  A couple years, that money drops off and Rossi has his money locked in.  THEN, we can figure out who if any between Rossi, a FA, Buium, Ohgren, Yurov, Wallstedt, is worth the $8-$10m offer.

We have no fucking clue of Marner or Ehlers want to choose the Wild of all places over every other place.  We don't know that.  Saving money for a rainy day big boy is dumb when 60 pts is right here already.

Edited 3 hours ago by Citizen Strife

[RedLake]

Rossi out Ehlers in. 

[WildNotMild]

1 hour ago, OldDutchChip said:

i too want to win, as i think the coach too. and he didn't bench Rossi, but he placed him on a line that he deserved.  Rossi went into a funk towards the end of the season. And that continued into the playoffs. Hartman was flat out better in every hockey category and he earned the promotion. And Rossi earned the demotion. Simple as that. This was the right call made by the coach to ensure that he gave his team the best chance to win. Rossi cumulative stats are nicer looking that Hartman but i am not sure anyone can say that Rossi deserves more time than Hartman. Or is that what you are trying to say? Do you want to place Hartman on L4 and move poor Rossi back to 2nd line? or maybe 1st? 

i'll say this again - balance is good. it's great in the playoffs when scoring gets much harder. if rossi's line can deliver - that would be amazing for us. him and trenin can exploit the easier matchups and provide the depth scoring that we need. 

Switch Gaudreau and Rossi.  Period, full stop.

[WildNotMild]

42 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

i think it comes down to how many non-physical players bill wants in top 6. rossi is a top 6 player (regardless of where he is playing now). bill does not see the physicality in him. we've talked about this too a ton - but there is currently zero deterrence in the top 6 (i guess if you want to play foligno there - but i hope we agree that he is not a top 6 guy) so can we really afford to play Boldy, Ek, Rossi, Yurov, Ohgren, Zuccy as our top 6 next year? there has to be at least one 🙂

Ek is not that, neither is Boldy. the rest are easy prey in the PO. we have thus far been lucky and survived vegas - but we want to win, not survive. all top teams are top 6 heavy teams. and play that way. we need at least one player that matches that and preferably on L1 to help Kap. 

would Rossi, Height, mult picks and Trenin 😉 be enough to get BT? 

This isn’t fantasy hockey, but even if it was, it usually isn’t a good trade when the offer is 5 players/picks for 1 player.  BT is older, more injury prone due to his style of play AND will need another big contract before Rossi’s first big contract ends.  
 
A team is almost always better built through the draft and growing and keeping its own players.  It is expensive to pay FA and you mortgage a lot of potential by trading so many picks and young players for one guy who can get hurt and/or decline.

[OldDutchChip]

24 minutes ago, Citizen Strife said:

The same Brady as Ottawa's "guy" that Rossi has the same points as while being a 4th liner.  Sure.  I'm so convinced Ottawa wants to get rid of him when they JUST made the playoffs for the first time in years.  For all we know, Brady wants to stay and will stay regardless of the offer.

We're not here saying Rossi at $6.5-$7.5m for 2-3 years is Elias Petterson at $11.6m for 8 years doing 45 points.  We're saying, "Here's some money to not be Dylan Cozens and drop off.  Now prove it before Yurov does it for free like you did."  

If Yurov or some free agent center is the guy, have them beat Rossi in production and force him off that way.  You can't tell me Mojo, Nyquist, Freddy, Hartman, etc. in their 30s have the upside Rossi has.  Rossi has more points than all those except Hartman...so what the fuck else does he need to do?  A couple years, that money drops off and Rossi has his money locked in.  THEN, we can figure out who if any between Rossi, a FA, Buium, Ohgren, Yurov, Wallstedt, is worth the $8-$10m offer.

We have no fucking clue of Marner or Ehlers want to choose the Wild of all places over every other place.  We don't know that.  Saving money for a rainy day big boy is dumb when 60 pts is right here already.

The same Brady as Ottawa's "guy" that Rossi has the same points as while being a 4th liner. yes the very same. once we stop clowning around - we can hopefully agree that Brady's impact goes a bit beyond the pts. He has shown that in that tournament. That hunger and drive. That is missing from Rossi. 

We're not here saying Rossi at $6.5-$7.5m for 2-3 years is Elias Petterson at $11.6m for 8 years doing 45 points.  We're saying, "Here's some money to not be Dylan Cozens and drop off.  Now prove it before Yurov does it for free like you did."   who is we? are you suggesting a bridge deal? is rossi willing to do that? 

If Yurov or some free agent center is the guy, have them beat Rossi in production and force him off that way.  It's not about points, its about fit and how to maximize your results. the points and performance during early go of the season doesn't mean shit if you can't deliver in the PO. i don't want to rely on a rookie (Yurov or Ohren) and at this point i know i can't rely on Rossi to give me that full energy, force and physicality that PO demands. 

You can't tell me Mojo, Nyquist, Freddy, Hartman, etc. in their 30s have the upside Rossi has.  no, but hartman is proving that he is more valuable to PO success than Rossi. And that's a fact. the other three should hopefully be gone with new year.

Rossi has more points than all those except Hartman...so what the fuck else does he need to do?  he can't do what's needed, that's the point. he can give you 60 pts. and that's not bad. but that's not what Wild need in top 6 player. they need to install brute force. he has none. zero. Yurov is TBD but Rossi is a known commodity. 

We have no fucking clue of Marner or Ehlers want to choose the Wild of all places over every other place.  We don't know that.  Saving money for a rainy day big boy is dumb when 60 pts is right here already. well i never said i wanted marner. toronto or some other team can overpay on him. i don't even want ehlers. i said all along that it's a smart approach, and not one where we jump on the first player who excepts. hence i said BT.

Basically -  it's knowing your club limitation - currently Wild are soft in their Top 6. and that will be exploited the further up you get to the cup. so they need to shore that up. show me a contender that had such a soft top 6? Rossi, Kap, Zuccy, Ek, Boldy, MJ? Will Nelson replace MJ and we'll be set? No we would not be.

[OldDutchChip]

12 minutes ago, WildNotMild said:

Switch Gaudreau and Rossi.  Period, full stop.

and a line of Freddy, Trenin and Braz will offer what exactly? 

you do realize that Trenin and Braz and Rossi were doing well enough and offered balance to our lines

that's how Vegas plays - look at their lines. they have players who can score everywhere but we want to make it easier on them by icing a line of Freddy, Trenin and Braz.....

[SkolWild73]

51 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

would you match 9 per on Rossi? i don't think you do that.

Probably not, especially if it goes to 9.2 and adds the extra first to the compensation 

[WildNotMild]

I have said this before.  The only slightly smart thing GMBG COULD be doing is waiting to try to resign Kaprizov before signing Rossi.  That way every potential dollar is available to lock up Kaprizov.  GMBG locked up Boldy at 7M a year very early.  I have to believe that he could’ve done the same with Rossi at a more important position (Center), but he is playing hardball like he did with Fiala because he doesn’t like him.  I really think we got lucky in the Fiala deal because of Faber, but some like ODC, aren’t that high on Faber.

[OldDutchChip]

5 minutes ago, WildNotMild said:

This isn’t fantasy hockey, but even if it was, it usually isn’t a good trade when the offer is 5 players/picks for 1 player.  BT is older, more injury prone due to his style of play AND will need another big contract before Rossi’s first big contract ends.  
 
A team is almost always better built through the draft and growing and keeping its own players.  It is expensive to pay FA and you mortgage a lot of potential by trading so many picks and young players for one guy who can get hurt and/or decline.

Tkachuk is 25. Kaprizov is what 28? 

So why does it matter the picks and prospects that may or may not develop into anything? 

you mortgage a lot of potential by trading why are we waiting for potential when we have Kaprizov in his prime NOW? 

[OldDutchChip]

1 minute ago, SkolWild73 said:

Probably not, especially if it goes to 9.2 and adds the extra first to the compensation 

right. agree.

[MacGyver]

Just like we have Rossi fatigue on this board I think Rossi has Wild fatigue and probably wants out so it's a problem that will take care of itself. He turned down Billy's low ball offer so he's out. In Billy's mind he's already gone. Personally I think Billy meddles with the line up in the playoffs at least to some degree.  I think it was Billy's call to play Fluery against the Blues until it was too late. A guy like Billy doesn't have room for too many independent thinkers around him. 

[WildNotMild]

2 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

and a line of Freddy, Trenin and Braz will offer what exactly? 

you do realize that Trenin and Braz and Rossi were doing well enough and offered balance to our lines

that's how Vegas plays - look at their lines. they have players who can score everywhere but we want to make it easier on them by icing a line of Freddy, Trenin and Braz.....

And at 5 vs. 5, what has the line of Nyquist, Gaudreau and Zuccy provided with MORE minutes.  Gaudreau isn’t faster or meaner than Rossi and Rossi plays more at the net than Gaudreau.

[OldDutchChip]

3 minutes ago, WildNotMild said:

I have said this before.  The only slightly smart thing GMBG COULD be doing is waiting to try to resign Kaprizov before signing Rossi.  That way every potential dollar is available to lock up Kaprizov.  GMBG locked up Boldy at 7M a year very early.  I have to believe that he could’ve done the same with Rossi at a more important position (Center), but he is playing hardball like he did with Fiala because he doesn’t like him.  I really think we got lucky in the Fiala deal because of Faber, but some like ODC, aren’t that high on Faber.

lucky? right.....fiala gave us a legit two line scoring threat. he had 35 goals this season and has 5 pts in 4 games.  let's not dump on him and be fair. he was and would be great with the team. the fault is billy's for mishandling it. yes he got faber and his suteresque ability to play a lot - for better of worth - but is that better than another threat from L2? would boldy and fiala be racking up 100 pts each? probably. so let's be a little more honest here. 

[OldDutchChip]

3 minutes ago, MacGyver said:

Just like we have Rossi fatigue on this board I think Rossi has Wild fatigue and probably wants out so it's a problem that will take care of itself. He turned down Billy's low ball offer so he's out. In Billy's mind he's already gone. Personally I think Billy meddles with the line up in the playoffs at least to some degree.  I think it was Billy's call to play Fluery against the Blues until it was too late. A guy like Billy doesn't have room for too many independent thinkers around him. 

word! 🍻

[WildNotMild]

2 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

Tkachuk is 25. Kaprizov is what 28? 

So why does it matter the picks and prospects that may or may not develop into anything? 

you mortgage a lot of potential by trading why are we waiting for potential when we have Kaprizov in his prime NOW? 

Again, this isn’t fantasy hockey.  If you trade some combination of Ohgren, Yurov, Rossi, Height, etc., then what players are replacing Braz, Nojo, etc.?  Plus, using your same “logic”, why would Ottawa want unproven or not good players for its best player.  
 

This is what is so frustrating about you ODC … you argue both sides of everything to try to prove your points.