Article: The Nyquist Trade Keeps the Wild's Recycling Plan Going

[Will D. Ness]

13 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

IF we don't do X, THEN KK leaves.  It's the centerpiece of every position you hold.

[OldDutchChip]

39 minutes ago, SkolWild73 said:

Where in my post did I say anything about nostalgic reasons or what we do???  Just pointed out that they can make more moves if they want.

the sarcasm was not meant to you, but for Wild and Billy in general. 

[mnfaninnc]

I'm not really upset about Nyquist, but let's be honest he's not worth a 2nd rounder for rental purposes by himself. But to retain $1.6m, he probably was. 

Yes, OCL wants to be back in the playoffs, and I think Nyquist can help us get there without clogging up future roster spots. If the Wild were going to sit Eriksson Ek until playoff time and then take off the duct tape, perhaps trading for a better player could also work...if that player was going to be resigned or has some term left. 

Right now, I'd suggest that Nico Sturm be a strong consideration to bring back and maybe even resign. He's cheap, can chip in secondary scoring and can win a faceoff. I also think he solidifies line 3. 

If it's me, I'd look at my score sheet and ask for Johansson to come into the office. Find a place for him and say, here or waivers? Just for argument, he worked hard at the beginning of the year, comparatively, but has fallen back into his cardio shifts. I'd rather have a guy like Sturm back in the lineup.

[OldDutchChip]

34 minutes ago, Will D. Ness said:

IF we don't do X, THEN KK leaves.  It's the centerpiece of every position you hold.

oh wow another point that stresses that - opinions that are not liked or stray from opinion of the crowd are ridiculed. got it.

why advocate for change or demand a better product or to identify and prioritize the most crucial piece that is vital to your success? well if your success is measured by mediocracy - we have made PO in 11 out of 13 years - then you right, nothing is needed! how foolish i am. you right! go Billy sign Brock Nelson, Brock Boeser and trade for Nicky Bjugstad so that we can all be happy that our team will continue to challenge for these prestigious wild card spots.

[OldDutchChip]

6 minutes ago, mnfaninnc said:

I'm not really upset about Nyquist, but let's be honest he's not worth a 2nd rounder for rental purposes by himself. But to retain $1.6m, he probably was. 

Yes, OCL wants to be back in the playoffs, and I think Nyquist can help us get there without clogging up future roster spots. If the Wild were going to sit Eriksson Ek until playoff time and then take off the duct tape, perhaps trading for a better player could also work...if that player was going to be resigned or has some term left. 

Right now, I'd suggest that Nico Sturm be a strong consideration to bring back and maybe even resign. He's cheap, can chip in secondary scoring and can win a faceoff. I also think he solidifies line 3. 

If it's me, I'd look at my score sheet and ask for Johansson to come into the office. Find a place for him and say, here or waivers? Just for argument, he worked hard at the beginning of the year, comparatively, but has fallen back into his cardio shifts. I'd rather have a guy like Sturm back in the lineup.

MJ played while two rookies were sent down. He could have sent MJ down, but he didn't and won't. There is no reality where MJ is not playing top 6 minutes. or at worse top 9. 

[mnfaninnc]

Yesterday's game was on TNT and it was nice to see the outcome without being able to watch.

But, the Wild have really been unwatchable lately. The structure that Heinzy has put in is nice except that with the injuries, I think, the vets filling in have started running out of gas. We saw this from Yeo when he tried to make an undersized team play hard and in a defensive structure. They had their yearly swoon around this time too as they simply had nothing in the tank.

In Utah, they were severely outplayed. In Colorado, the speed of the Avs was far too much to handle. What was concerning was that it didn't look like players were loafing, it just looked like they got physically taken to the woodshed. In that kind of environment, a goalie has to be perfect and both goalies let in softies. Perhaps they are feeling like they have to do more than usual? 

What's even more concerning is that Rossi and Boldy do not put up consistent performances. They need to be PPGs and then some, and they need to be on the scoresheet nightly. They're not. 

My conclusion is that the Wild will be competitive against teams in the 12-20 ranking and hopefully can take care of business against teams ranked below 20, but if they are top 12 teams, the Wild aren't even competitive. The silver lining is that Calgary has a really tough stretch and St. Louis and Utah are quite far behind. 

I'm hoping for a good Western trip, but probably won't stay up to watch preparing for the worst. 

[mnfaninnc]

3 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

MJ played while two rookies were sent down. He could have sent MJ down, but he didn't and won't. There is no reality where MJ is not playing top 6 minutes. or at worse top 9.

So, what you're really saying here is that Guerin is not looking down at the yearly stat sheet.

Yes, 2 rookies were sent down. I'd rather see them up here. Confidence is a large contributor, perhaps they can gain some confidence and be back up soon. Do we have confidence in that? I think it's waning. 

[OldDutchChip]

4 minutes ago, mnfaninnc said:

So, what you're really saying here is that Guerin is not looking down at the yearly stat sheet.

Yes, 2 rookies were sent down. I'd rather see them up here. Confidence is a large contributor, perhaps they can gain some confidence and be back up soon. Do we have confidence in that? I think it's waning. 

i think he has tied himself to the next batch of "his" players and we are witnessing essentially the same thing as before (ZP and RS) with old vets are running the show. MJ is a Billy player and he stays. Billy has thus far failed to re-construct the team to compliment Kaprizov (and had plenty of chances to do so and did nothing) and is now forced to patch together this "product" yet again with more of his guys (innovative thinking is non-existent) just so that the team makes it to PO. to point to not enough money and keep crying about buy outs, allows an out for him - we are not looking at it just from current situation, but his full tenure. planning had to have happened on day 1. Six years later, where are we? Trying yet again to get in as a WC and celebrating a chance to maybe avoid a central team for a round before the inevitability? But NO, let's keep positivity high and look forward to another promise of greatness not too far ahead! hahaha😉

[SkolWild73]

4 minutes ago, mnfaninnc said:

What's even more concerning is that Rossi and Boldy do not put up consistent performances. They need to be PPGs and then some, and they need to be on the scoresheet nightly. They're not. 

That is a pretty tough ask of two 23-year-old players.  Plus, there are only 35 PPG players in the entire league right now, and only 20 averaging more than 1.1, in other words each team averages about 1 PPG player and ours is Kap.  Boldy is 56th and Rossi is 62nd which is pretty good.  Boldy did not show up on the score sheet against Boston but did have 8 shots on goal.

The last 22 games, Boldy has 21 points. and Rossi 18.  If I go back 24 games for Rossi, he has 22 points in those games.  Not far off of PPG for either of them.

[Will D. Ness]

17 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

oh wow another point that stresses that - opinions that are not liked or stray from opinion of the crowd are ridiculed. got it.

why advocate for change or demand a better product or to identify and prioritize the most crucial piece that is vital to your success? well if your success is measured by mediocracy - we have made PO in 11 out of 13 years - then you right, nothing is needed! how foolish i am. you right! go Billy sign Brock Nelson, Brock Boeser and trade for Nicky Bjugstad so that we can all be happy that our team will continue to challenge for these prestigious wild card spots.

Dude, you were the one calling out "If/Then".

To be honest, I like opinions that go against the grain as long as they aren't just the same old gripes.

[OldDutchChip]

3 minutes ago, Will D. Ness said:

Dude, you were the one calling out "If/Then".

To be honest, I like opinions that go against the grain as long as they aren't just the same old gripes.

yes i said "oh stop with IF this happens THEN that happens. it's almost like buyouts were god sent haha. so why are you then complaining about them?" which was to bring a topic back to its original point and not stray off course. 

as for If Wild don't do enough THEN kap leaves - i do stand by my assertion that Wild are failing to make their case to the one superstar they've ever had.

[SkolWild73]

3 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

Trying yet again to get in as a WC and celebrating a chance to maybe avoid a central team for a round before the inevitability?

So, with Kap back and the team healthy, you don't think this team has a chance to make a run?  With Kap healthy, not including the three games he came back for in January, we were on a 106-point pace.  There are only four teams in the league that are above that pace, Washington, Winnipeg, Dallas and Toronto.  If the Wild have no chance, who then has a chance to make a run, just those 4 teams?  Edmonton must not have a chance since they are only on pace for 101 and that is with McDavid.  Colorado must not have a chance since they are on pace for 97 and that is with McKinnon.  Tampa is on pace for 103 with a healthy Kucherov, they must not stand a chance either. 

I would think that having the best player in the world or top 3 anyway, our team would have a chance against anyone, especially since the supporting cast has played to a 102-point season without him.  Not saying we will, but I don't see why we can't.  

[OldDutchChip]

1 minute ago, SkolWild73 said:

So, with Kap back and the team healthy, you don't think this team has a chance to make a run?  With Kap healthy, not including the three games he came back for in January, we were on a 106-point pace.  There are only four teams in the league that are above that pace, Washington, Winnipeg, Dallas and Toronto.  If the Wild have no chance, who then has a chance to make a run, just those 4 teams?  Edmonton must not have a chance since they are only on pace for 101 and that is with McDavid.  Colorado must not have a chance since they are on pace for 97 and that is with McKinnon.  Tampa is on pace for 103 with a healthy Kucherov, they must not stand a chance either. 

I would think that having the best player in the world or top 3 anyway, our team would have a chance against anyone, especially since the supporting cast has played to a 102-point season without him.  Not saying we will, but I don't see why we can't.  

So, with Kap back and the team healthy, you don't think this team has a chance to make a run?  With Kap healthy, not including the three games he came back for in January, we were on a 106-point pace. of course i do! and i've been advocating for pushing in and getting him help when we were on top. he is THAT good. our goalie was and still is very good. our D is good to great. besides our horrendous PK .... but that seems like unfixable part of our team. so yes. i think any team with Kap has a chance, especially if he is healthy. He is not healthy. I blame Billy for that. I do.  so i am not sure why we are arguing that. i think we are on the same position 🙂

my point is that Billy has not done enough to prioritize Kap and is now just doing it to save his ass. in 6 years he did not help Kaprizov at ALL. he skated with Harty and Zuccy for most of the time. 4th line journey man and forgotten tiny player from Norway. And he dragged them to a PPG status - that's crazy. Kap is THE best player on earth. And i am predicting he'll go to east coast team. We are too busy planning for the future and worry about lesser priorities than actually take care of the one that is the most of important of them all. 

[Enforceror]

4 minutes ago, SkolWild73 said:

That is a pretty tough ask of two 23-year-old players.  Plus, there are only 35 PPG players in the entire league right now, and only 20 averaging more than 1.1, in other words each team averages about 1 PPG player and ours is Kap.  Boldy is 56th and Rossi is 62nd which is pretty good.  Boldy did not show up on the score sheet against Boston but did have 8 shots on goal.

The last 22 games, Boldy has 21 points. and Rossi 18.  If I go back 24 games for Rossi, he has 22 points in those games.  Not far off of PPG for either of them.

I thought it was interesting that Boldy is 5th in the NHL with shots on goal and has a better shooting % than both M Tkachuk and Mackinnon (who are 2nd and 3rd in SOG). Looking into where these shots are coming from was also interesting:

High danger goals, Boldy is 35th in the league. Unblocked attempts = 45th

Med danger goals = 37th. Unblocked attempts = 31st

Low danger goals = 6th Unblocked attempts

Shots on goal per game = 10th

 

[SkolWild73]

Just now, Enforceror said:

I thought it was interesting that Boldy is 5th in the NHL with shots on goal and has a better shooting % than both M Tkachuk and Mackinnon (who are 2nd and 3rd in SOG). Looking into where these shots are coming from was also interesting:

High danger goals, Boldy is 35th in the league. Unblocked attempts = 45th

Med danger goals = 37th. Unblocked attempts = 31st

Low danger goals = 6th Unblocked attempts

Shots on goal per game = 10th

 

I saw that during the Boston game.  Thanks for looking into it deeper.

[Protec]

We can all agree, NoJo sucks, we need #97 back, and Nyquist is an upgrade over Knudi or Ohgren. 

[SkolWild73]

8 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

So, with Kap back and the team healthy, you don't think this team has a chance to make a run?  With Kap healthy, not including the three games he came back for in January, we were on a 106-point pace. of course i do! and i've been advocating for pushing in and getting him help when we were on top. he is THAT good. our goalie was and still is very good. our D is good to great. besides our horrendous PK .... but that seems like unfixable part of our team. so yes. i think any team with Kap has a chance, especially if he is healthy. He is not healthy. I blame Billy for that. I do.  so i am not sure why we are arguing that. i think we are on the same position 🙂

my point is that Billy has not done enough to prioritize Kap and is now just doing it to save his ass. in 6 years he did not help Kaprizov at ALL. he skated with Harty and Zuccy for most of the time. 4th line journey man and forgotten tiny player from Norway. And he dragged them to a PPG status - that's crazy. Kap is THE best player on earth. And i am predicting he'll go to east coast team. We are too busy planning for the future and worry about lesser priorities than actually take care of the one that is the most of important of them all. 

Trying yet again to get in as a WC and celebrating a chance to maybe avoid a central team for a round before the inevitability?  This is why I asked the question, because that doesn't sound like someone that thinks we have a chance, unless you were assuming that Kap would not be back or fully healthy for the playoffs.

I was not super excited about adding Nyquist, but that is who we have.  The way I look at it, if everyone gets back healthy, are we not a slightly better team with Nyquist than without him?  

I am not arguing anything else.  Maybe there were moves to be made that might have made this team better, maybe there wasn't.  My main point is, shouldn't we celebrate this team for what it is and the damn good effort they have made through all these injuries to at least have a chip and a chair with a chance to make a run?

[OldDutchChip]

3 minutes ago, SkolWild73 said:

Trying yet again to get in as a WC and celebrating a chance to maybe avoid a central team for a round before the inevitability?  This is why I asked the question, because that doesn't sound like someone that thinks we have a chance, unless you were assuming that Kap would not be back or fully healthy for the playoffs.

I was not super excited about adding Nyquist, but that is who we have.  The way I look at it, if everyone gets back healthy, are we not a slightly better team with Nyquist than without him?  

I am not arguing anything else.  Maybe there were moves to be made that might have made this team better, maybe there wasn't.  My main point is, shouldn't we celebrate this team for what it is and the damn good effort they have made through all these injuries to at least have a chip and a chair with a chance to make a run?

and i guess that's all we can do. just make the best of the team as it rolls into PO. what's done is done. and similarly, what's not done is not done (what was possible we will never know). we are who we are 🙂 i am confident that we can get to PO. but i said plenty - it is a MUST to get out of R1. i think if we fail - Kap waits and does not sign in July. that is my biggest worry and we are going to battle with added nyquist. shit. but if Kap is back to his usual self, it won't matter - he can drag us over that PO hump. 

 

[Dango]

I do think some team will sign #90 though ,  maybe his speed can work with a young Bedard or perhaps a depth player for a team that loses a middle / bottom 6 guy in free agency  im sure some guys will get plucked and #90  can fill a void .

[Citizen Strife]

Maybe we can get Donato for Johansson...same money.

*nope.  Chicago wouldn't be that stupid*

Edited 8 hours ago by Citizen Strife

[Dango]

1 minute ago, Citizen Strife said:

Maybe we can get Donato for Johansson...same money.

*nope.  Chicago wouldn't be that stupid*

They will probably lose Donato so throw is Chisholm as bait

[Citizen Strife]

If it takes Chisholm to get Johansson or Hartman off the team early?  Deal.

[SkolWild73]

6 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

and i guess that's all we can do. just make the best of the team as it rolls into PO. what's done is done. and similarly, what's not done is not done (what was possible we will never know). we are who we are 🙂 i am confident that we can get to PO. but i said plenty - it is a MUST to get out of R1. i think if we fail - Kap waits and does not sign in July. that is my biggest worry and we are going to battle with added nyquist. shit. but if Kap is back to his usual self, it won't matter - he can drag us over that PO hump. 

 

I agree.  I might be one of the few, but I wouldn't mind if we stay in the third slot and play Dallas.  There is no team I hate more than them and nothing would be more satisfying than beating them.  With that said, I also think they might be the best team in the West, but if you want to make the Cup, you have to beat good teams.

[Will D. Ness]

36 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

yes i said "oh stop with IF this happens THEN that happens. it's almost like buyouts were god sent haha. so why are you then complaining about them?" which was to bring a topic back to its original point and not stray off course. 

as for If Wild don't do enough THEN kap leaves - i do stand by my assertion that Wild are failing to make their case to the one superstar they've ever had.

Fair enough.  I thought you were calling him out for the same thing you do.

Regarding Kap... it's early in the game.  I know that MN fans are crazy insecure about this so I tend to think there is a general overcompensation in the narrative about it.  Has the GM painted us into a corner?  Kind of... but still that bridge isn't crossed yet.  

Nyquist potentially being signed is minimal IMO.  Actually, he could have some value.

[Dean]

2 million $ Ryan donato has more goals (22)  than. Nyquist has points. . More goals than Jo Jo (20), Marat (7), Hartman (17) or trenin (13)have in points .  He’s is one point from doubling ek (24pts) in points , has as many goals as moose has in points. 16 pts more than Fred an 5 points more than zucc Hell he’s 1 goal behind kappy and would be second on team in goals . All for 2 million and I doubt he has clauses. 
     They were talking about it on daily face off. It just shows how pathetic the valuation the wild put on there bottom six guys / top six or whatever the misfits are . I’m not saying trade for him but rather it points out there’s better value out there . So cap hell  is a b.s. excuse. 
   The other thing they talked about was they heard a gm was told by owner to get him a player via offer sheet this summer. They think this will be a summer of offer sheets. .. where does that leave Rossi an all this so called money they have in spring? Idk.