Article: Revenge Wasn't A Good Look For the Wild

[Tony Abbott]

View full article

[OldDutchChip]

It was the wrong kind of revenge plain and simple. Montoya did not get Andre the Giant to kill the guy, he did it himself. When a captain is taken out like that, you don't let one minion fight another. You take it upon yourself (Top Players/Leaders) to go against the top dogs from Nash and battle it out (have them answer for the idiocy of the others. That is what was needed.

We, predictably, sent out our brutes vs their brutes for the battle of "no-one-gives-a-shit".  Proven by Heureux trying to take out Rossi.... I know i should be glad that the kid did the QB slide....but part of me wonders if he could have instead of laying down, turned and blasted Heureux shoulder to shoulder or if that is who this group is - QB sliding...instead of pushing through, get that first down or in our case - reach another level (PO success).

Putting Rossi self-preservation aside - we are left with Ek and Boldy. I am sticking with my previous point - i think that is who should have fought. They should have fought Forsberg or O'Reilly. Instead they were .... just there i guess.

Some will say - it's the code and job of Foligno to go get retribution.....but for me - (a) to change the way your entire team is viewed and (b) to get the message about the play to the entire team - you must take it up with the leadership. 

The response was wasted on Heureux. It was wasted on the Nashville team. And it was wasted on the league. It is still open season on Wild since no one in the top 6 has the balls to stand up.

One of the three - Boldy, Ek or Rossi i think has to go. Maybe after the season, IF Canes flop, we can orchestrate a Boldy for Svechnikov deal. Then line up Kap, Svech and Yurov. 

[mnhockeyfan03]

2 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

One of the three - Boldy, Ek or Rossi i think has to go. Maybe after the season, IF Canes flop, we can orchestrate a Boldy for Svechnikov deal. Then line up Kap, Svech and Yurov. 

I think Rossi for sure has to go.  Look at how he plays against the playoff teams in the west.  He is non existent out there and gets manhandled and it will only get worse in the playoffs.  He plays great against the east because they don’t check or against the bad west teams because they are terrible.  He is not what we need on this team.  We also don’t need Zuccarello, he is way too much of a passenger.  I could also be on board trading Boldy as well for the right piece.  He is to inconsistent and doesn’t play a big game even though he is a big body.  Also Spurgeon has to go eventually (probably this summer).  Watch jiricek how he clears out the front of the net.  We have no other dmen that can do that besides Middleton.  All the good west teams have big trees for dmen and they clear everyone out from the front of the net.  Our small dmen get pushed around.  We have a lot of holes on this team and our top 6 is not near good enough.  On a Stanley cup team Erickson ek would play 3rd line center.  We need 2 legit top 6 centers not on the roster and a big power RH forward for the top 6.   

[OldDutchChip]

3 minutes ago, mnhockeyfan03 said:

I think Rossi for sure has to go.  Look at how he plays against the playoff teams in the west.  He is non existent out there and gets manhandled and it will only get worse in the playoffs.  He plays great against the east because they don’t check or against the bad west teams because they are terrible.  He is not what we need on this team.  We also don’t need Zuccarello, he is way too much of a passenger.  I could also be on board trading Boldy as well for the right piece.  He is to inconsistent and doesn’t play a big game even though he is a big body.  Also Spurgeon has to go eventually (probably this summer).  Watch jiricek how he clears out the front of the net.  We have no other dmen that can do that besides Middleton.  All the good west teams have big trees for dmen and they clear everyone out from the front of the net.  Our small dmen get pushed around.  We have a lot of holes on this team and our top 6 is not near good enough.  On a Stanley cup team Erickson ek would play 3rd line center.  We need 2 legit top 6 centers not on the roster and a big power RH forward for the top 6.   

That's quiet a list there 🙂

I think for me - the priority is Top 6. Our D should be fine with Zeev and possibly one of the prospects pushing to get through. But the softness up top needs to be fixed. 

[mnhockeyfan03]

7 minutes ago, OldDutchChip said:

That's quiet a list there 🙂

I think for me - the priority is Top 6. Our D should be fine with Zeev and possibly one of the prospects pushing to get through. But the softness up top needs to be fixed. 

Yeh not expecting all the to get fixed this season but over the offseason a lot of trades and things need to happen or Kap is going to walk.  We are a very soft team and our big guys like Foligno and Trenin can’t skate and should be 4th line guys on a deep team but we are overpaying them for that.  We need spurgeons salary to help fix the top 6.  I think we are going to fall back to being a wild card team and very likely on the fringe of missing the playoffs later in the year.  We play a lot of the good teams in the west in the second half.  Many changes are needed to be made with this roster and we aren’t even close

[Citizen Strife]

Again with the Rossi BS.

Do I have to remind people that just like the Boldy discussion, do you just expect to find Top 50 scorers out of thin air?  The top line, Kap or not, is pretty much the only one scoring each game.  Hartman and Ek have found some, but that's it.  I figured we were over this and moving to the real problem: Brodin and Spurgeon still matter.  So much that the fucking Preds threw 6 on a team that was almost impossible to score on early in the season.  Giving up 4-6 is becoming a worrying trend, and I think everyone on the team (though Brodin and Spurgeon lead the charge) has to buy into that structure to make it work.

Tell me exactly what a team lacking high end offense does getting rid of Rossi or Boldy for some grass is greener option?  You already have Foligno and Trenin's on the team.  You need to keep the scorers and add more.

Edited 5 hours ago by Citizen Strife

[mnhockeyfan03]

3 minutes ago, Citizen Strife said:

Again with the Rossi BS.

Do I have to remind people that just like the Boldy discussion, do you just expect to find Top 50 scorers out of thin air?  The top line, Kap or not, is pretty much the only one scoring each game.  Hartman and Ek have found some, but that's it.  I figured we were over this and moving to the real problem: Brodin and Spurgeon still matter.  So much that the fucking Preds threw 6 on a team that was almost impossible to score on early in the season.  Giving up 4-6 is becoming a worrying trend, and I think everyone on the team (though Brodin and Spurgeon lead the charge) has to buy into that structure to make it work.

Tell me exactly what a team lacking high end offense does getting rid of Rossi or Boldy for some grass is greener option?  You already have Foligno and Trenin's on the team.  You need to keep the scorers and add more.

Please watch Rossi against the playoff teams in the west that we have to play when it matters.  How is he doing in those games?  Not well at all.  Watch those games not the fluff games against Chicago, San Jose etc.  only go off the top west teams as he gets worked over and is overmatched 

[OldDutchChip]

17 minutes ago, Citizen Strife said:

Again with the Rossi BS.

Do I have to remind people that just like the Boldy discussion, do you just expect to find Top 50 scorers out of thin air?  The top line, Kap or not, is pretty much the only one scoring each game.  Hartman and Ek have found some, but that's it.  I figured we were over this and moving to the real problem: Brodin and Spurgeon still matter.  So much that the fucking Preds threw 6 on a team that was almost impossible to score on early in the season.  Giving up 4-6 is becoming a worrying trend, and I think everyone on the team (though Brodin and Spurgeon lead the charge) has to buy into that structure to make it work.

Tell me exactly what a team lacking high end offense does getting rid of Rossi or Boldy for some grass is greener option?  You already have Foligno and Trenin's on the team.  You need to keep the scorers and add more.

It's not about goals and points. a team that has zero spine in its top 6 besides it's superstar is not constructed to yield results we all deserve. that's what florida was. it had huby and top offense, it sacrificed their 100 pt player to get something they needed more. boldy/rossi - are just like huby - they are not the players that drag their team to victory and thru challenges. 

[Citizen Strife]

So who exactly is going to get those greasy/gritty goals to make up for Rossi being let go?  Good luck getting to playoffs outright without the stuff Rossi is providing.  We have no idea that Ohgren or Yurov are just going to flip that switch.  Sure as shit doesn't look like Khusnutdinov is that guy.

No team is just a bunch of 6'6 goons.  Talent doesn't grow on trees.

Edited 4 hours ago by Citizen Strife

[Citizen Strife]

Hey, here's an idea: let's go get Miller: a 30-year old hot headed idiot, or Petterson, who is making a mint we can't afford.  I'm sure they'd just salivate at the thought of Rossi and Boldy (and a shit ton more) in exchange.  Just an example.

Lest we forget a team led by those two are ON the playoff bubble.  A team with Rossi and Boldy leading the charge is still ahead of them and all that high priced money.  Finding the right mix is hard, and I'm willing to see the season for what it is: ravaged by injures and not the fault of the 2-3 top line players the team has left.

[mnhockeyfan03]

I just looked it up and Rossi only has 6 points in 15 games against playoff teams in the west.  That’s not getting it done and a reason why we are struggling against those teams.  

[Pewterschmidt]

12 minutes ago, Citizen Strife said:

We have no idea that Ohgren or Yurov are just going to flip that switch.

Prediction: Ogz becomes a real nhl ‘r on his third team when he realizes he needs to grow a pair or he’s out of the league.  Last night he looked like the player who no showed on scoresheet for all those WJC tourneys.  Even though he was the captain.  I was hoping to see more from him after his long stint in Iowa.  Hoping he’d come back up and play with some piss & vinegar.  Nope.  Same scared boy.  

[OldDutchChip]

17 minutes ago, Citizen Strife said:

So who exactly is going to get those greasy/gritty goals to make up for Rossi being let go?  Good luck getting to playoffs outright without the stuff Rossi is providing.  We have no idea that Ohgren or Yurov are just going to flip that switch.  Sure as shit doesn't look like Khusnutdinov is that guy.

No team is just a bunch of 6'6 goons.  Talent doesn't grow on trees.

Well if you want something - you pay for it. I think Billy knows it.

Neither Ek, Boldy or Rossi can bring it. One of them will be traded. Deal with it.

[OldDutchChip]

9 minutes ago, Citizen Strife said:

Hey, here's an idea: let's go get Miller: a 30-year old hot headed idiot, or Petterson, who is making a mint we can't afford.  I'm sure they'd just salivate at the thought of Rossi and Boldy (and a shit ton more) in exchange.  Just an example.

Lest we forget a team led by those two are ON the playoff bubble.  A team with Rossi and Boldy leading the charge is still ahead of them and all that high priced money.  Finding the right mix is hard, and I'm willing to see the season for what it is: ravaged by injures and not the fault of the 2-3 top line players the team has left.

The fact that our current top 6 of Ek, Rossi and Boldy did nothing when they should have done something speaks volume. Believe it. You think any of the western teams worry about Wild in the PO? They would LOVE to take their shot at them. That is the big picture. The fact that outside of our bottom 6, we have NO ONE to have the balls to stand up when times comes.  

[Citizen Strife]

Billy DOESN"T have to pay for anything until next year, and he can't if he wanted to.  The team is on a tightrope as is and is ravaged by injuries.  Injuries that sapped whatever cap space they could have used.  Brodin, Spurgeon?  Get rid of them for cap space and we've seen the result.  Rossi and Boldy?  Who in the current roster suddenly scores every game to make up that difference?  The team is kinda boned either way.  You're so scared of Kap packing his bags?  Do any of those things for a quick fix, and that's one way to do it.

Ottawa isn't getting rid of Brady, so we can stop bringing that one up.

Edited 4 hours ago by Citizen Strife

[OldDutchChip]

8 minutes ago, Pewterschmidt said:

Prediction: Ogz becomes a real nhl ‘r on his third team when he realizes he needs to grow a pair or he’s out of the league.  Last night he looked like the player who no showed on scoresheet for all those WJC tourneys.  Even though he was the captain.  I was hoping to see more from him after his long stint in Iowa.  Hoping he’d come back up and play with some piss & vinegar.  Nope.  Same scared boy.  

- 4..... kid is special

send him back again, the spot is Yurov's, not his

[OldDutchChip]

8 minutes ago, Citizen Strife said:

Billy DOESN"T have to pay for anything until next year, and he can't if he wanted to.  The team is on a tightrope as is and is ravaged by injuries.  Injuries that sapped whatever cap space they could have used.  Brodin, Spurgeon?  Get rid of them for cap space and we've seen the result.  Rossi and Boldy?  Who in the current roster suddenly scores every game to make up that difference?  The team is kinda boned either way.  You're so scared of Kap packing his bags?  Do any of those things for a quick fix, and that's one way to do it.

Ottawa isn't getting rid of Brady, so we can stop bringing that one up.

Yes Brady is out. Then try for Tuch. Tell Spurge to sit his ass out and get the injury $. If Kap comes back - we should be get it fine. Get Tuch in, bring Spurge and tell Ek to deliver punishment, instead of receiving it. And hope Boldy ramps up his game....but i am not sure - i think my earlier post about potential swap of Boldy and Svechnikov.....that's very enticing and one i'd look out for. 

[Citizen Strife]

Teams aren't afraid of the Wild because they don't "beat people up."  That's Tony's point of the article.  You want to make teams pay?  Make them reticent to pull off stupid shit by having a better offense or a killer defense (or both) to frustrate them.  Make them think, "oh shit.  If we go down a man, we lose to this guy, this guy, this guy, or even THAT guy."

The Wild have a glaring hole in the Top 6 already with Johansson.  That'll rectify itself with a trade if he wants to leave, which is unlikely, or waiting for the off season to roll off.  Yurov can't come until next year (probably).  Getting Tuch or Nelson or Boeser, or any of those solutions can't be figured out easily without losing something the Wild need: structure to screw with teams heads and the firepower to make them pay for mistakes.  Injuries screw up whatever structure the team had to play competitive and smart to overcome the offensive deficiency this year.

If you want Rossi or Boldy gone, do it after the season.  Making a seachange of that magnitude with an injury ravaged mess and throwing out whatever good offensive or defensive players we have to do it makes things even worse.  Teams don't just swap players with ease.  It's not a video game.

My main issue is trying to salvage a season that is already on leaky waters as is with no money to fix the problem.  Doing thing during draft time would make way more sense.  If you want to get rid of Rossi for someone else, do it after you have evidence that he was the one sole reason the team failed.  The team has way more issues than one player swap.

Edited 3 hours ago by Citizen Strife

[OldDutchChip]

5 minutes ago, Citizen Strife said:

Teams aren't afraid of the Wild because they don't "beat people up."  That's Tony's point of the article.  You want to make teams pay?  Make them reticent to pull off stupid shit by having a better offense or a killer defense (or both) to frustrate them.  Make them think, "oh shit.  If we go down a man, we lose to this guy, this guy, this guy, or even THAT guy."

The Wild have a glaring hole in the Top 6 already with Johansson.  That'll rectify itself with a trade if he wants to leave, which is unlikely, or waiting for the off season to roll off.  Yurov can't come until next year (probably).  Getting Tuch or Nelson or Boeser, or any of those solutions can't be figured out easily without losing something the Wild need: structure to screw with teams heads and the firepower to make them pay for mistakes.  Injuries screw up whatever structure the team had to play competitive and smart to overcome the offensive deficiency this year.

If you want Rossi or Boldy gone, do it after the season.  Making a seachange of that magnitude with an injury ravaged mess and throwing out whatever good offensive or defensive players we have to do it makes things even worse.  Teams don't just swap players with ease.  It's not a video game.

My main issue is trying to salvage a season that is already on leaky waters as is with no money to fix the problem.  Doing thing during draft time would make way more sense.  If you want to get rid of Rossi for someone else, do it after you have evidence that he was the one sole reason the team failed.  The team has way more issues than one player swap.

i disagree with Tony's point. I think deterrence is real and to stand up you need your top 6 to engage and not delegate to 3/4th liners. If you don't have those players - you deal for them. If Ek, Rossi and Boldy (i guess we'll add Zuccy and MJ there for now) can't deliver (and there is NOTHING in the pipeline) then you need to scout the league and see if you can steal someone like that. Yes it will cost you. But that's a known. 

As far as timing - i think the way the season has gone, you can't just back track. Kap will be back and he will drag us to relevancy and competitiveness. We will be in the playoffs. I think Billy will act. Time will tell who remains in our top 6. Besides Zuccy and Kap - the rest are no guarantees.

[Burnt Toast]

1 hour ago, mnhockeyfan03 said:

We play a lot of the good teams in the west in the second half.

Good news. We have the third easiest schedule to finish the year. ( Pretty much). I think the Wild need to add big good players while keeping the guys producing ( Rossi Boldly Zuc). I agree our young players need to develop a playoff edge. They have had opportunities, be it in lower levels. I think the Stramel/ Jiri adds point to what you see as needs for playoff success in the future. I see the Wild improving over the next few years. 

[Burnt Toast]

51 minutes ago, mnhockeyfan03 said:

Rossi

Has made big strides this year. Now you’re expecting him to lead the team in the playoffs at age 23? I don’t think he’s the problem. The problem is the Wild lack a minimum of three big additions. How? No idea lol. We finally have some good young players, we need to give them time to develop. We’re building a solid core, hopefully we can continue to make additions over the next few years. 2027

[Burnt Toast]

28 minutes ago, Citizen Strife said:

Teams don't just swap players with ease. 

100% agree. I may not be a hockey expert but over the last 5 years I could pick out the players on the Wild that were either really bad, overpaid or both. The NHL keeps records of the best, and worst contracts in the league. The Wild had the two worst! That’s before the buyouts. Slowly they have replaced the underperforming players. VERY slowly. I see two more players getting replaced after this season, replaced by better players? That’s what I’m counting on.