Article: Dylan Guenther Fits the Bill For A Marco Rossi Trade Return

[Tony Abbott]

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[Backwoodsbob]

Nope! Give Rossi another year before deciding to move a player that is in the Calder Memorial Trophy race even thou it is Bedards to lose.

 

[Burnt Toast]

Sounds intriguing. I’m guessing SLC is going to want to come out swinging next year. With that in mind Rossi is the kind of two way player coaches love. The Wild are in need of secondary scoring so… I love Rossi but sounds like a great landing spot for him. Win- win.

[OldDutchChip]

Every one of our moves needs to be made with the intent to optimize Kap and to ensure Kap stays. This one does not do that. And if it's made, that takes away one of our biggest trade chips and hence basically ensures Kap leaves. If that happens, no haul will be sufficient - Wild will essentially become irrelevant again. Rossi, Boldy, Ek are nothing without Kap. Once that is realized, here is what we are left with - 

What's working against us - team is struggling apart from 1st line. Missed the playoffs.....Yes, the cap is going up and penalty are going down, but the money is being spent unwisely and the plan is somewhat fuzzy at best as to how Wild will look like in 1-2 years. As for destinations that are more appealing to Kap - i really think its at this point 90% vs 10% that he leaves (a) girlfriend likely wants a more posh place and (b) NY's other team should be able to fit him in

What's working for us - Kap IS thinking about his legacy. He looks around the league and the "desirable" teams and location are taken .... NY Rangers have Panarin, Tampa - Kuch, LA - Fiala & Daughty ??? (Nah) Florida - Barkov / Tkachuk......

I don't think he wants to be a follower. Now he looks to Ovi and says - Ovi stayed with ONE team and won. Took a few rough patches but he stayed and WON. So that's where we can immediately start swinging that balance in our favor and it becomes 10% that he leaves vs 90% he stays. Plan -

First - We make him Captain. As soon as possible. Do not wait until he leaves for vacation. Do it now! It makes sense from strategic planning and performance and leadership standpoint.

Next - our planning for 2-5 years is not a feasible route. You need to show results next year! So we need to use our draft capital and current players to upgrade and maximize potential of Kap and HIS team. Everyone other than Yurov needs to be available and utilized. That includes Heidt and Rossi. Surgeon and Gus too. And our upcoming 1st/2nds. There also need to be very real talk with MJ and Freddy and ensuring their money is used other means (AHL or whoknowshow). 

Someone mentioned Brady Tkachuk and that is perfect. You throw an offer Ottawa cannot refuse. Give them picks, prospect and make the money work. Do they want Spurge, please want him!! Then go get Buchnevich and a D partner for Midds.

That gives you a team that is going to be hell to play with immediately next year. That tells Kap you are our Captain, you have a team to lead. He tells his GF - hey we are making it work here and he cannot leave.

Line 1 Kap Tkachuk Buch

Line 2 Body EK Yurok (promise him a spot - call him right now and promise him)

Hey i would even extend Zuccy right now for 2 more years till he is 40! 

[Stymie]

 I'm sick of rumors abott moving Rossi,  who was our number one five on five player. And if you had any eyes on Rossi over the year you would see that he made some passes that were outstanding... So much so I think they surprised the player who didn't finish it off. Look at his points that he had as a junior, he's a great passer.,if he has a winger get a can score he's going to be a dangerous player to play against

[IllicitFive]

So lets trade a center, which we don't have many of that just finished his first year, was close to top of team in 5 on 5 scoring, was being talked about as a potential calder finalist for winger who is taller and lighter with similar numbers. Dylan also played with Logan Cooley and Crouse. Cooley  had 20 g 24 a in  82 games. Dylan 24 g 26 a in 78 games. Rossi 21 g 20 a while playing chunks of the year with the likes of NOJO and Lucchini and Lettieri. I would argue Cooley and Crouse are better line mates. Who we putting as 2nd line C next year? Gaudreau? I just don't understand the whole "we gotta move Rossi" thing.

[OldDutchChip]

Pick a Wild team with Rossi or with Kaprizov

It will not be with both

Once you decided, you’ll know what needs to be done and why

Vegas did not win by holding on to Tuch when there was a chance to upgrade

florida did not hesitate to send out 100pt player for Tkachuk

Rossi is neither Tuch nor is he a future 100 pt player, if we can package him and another prize for a stud like tkachuk, we do it immediately 

 

[kapislife]

14 minutes ago, IllicitFive said:

So lets trade a center, which we don't have many of that just finished his first year, was close to top of team in 5 on 5 scoring, was being talked about as a potential calder finalist for winger who is taller and lighter with similar numbers. Dylan also played with Logan Cooley and Crouse. Cooley  had 20 g 24 a in  82 games. Dylan 24 g 26 a in 78 games. Rossi 21 g 20 a while playing chunks of the year with the likes of NOJO and Lucchini and Lettieri. I would argue Cooley and Crouse are better line mates. Who we putting as 2nd line C next year? Gaudreau? I just don't understand the whole "we gotta move Rossi" thing.

I dont think anyone really understands it. Bill guerin is just proving to be a dumbass GM to join the list of all the other morons the wild have had run the team.

[IllicitFive]

6 minutes ago, kapislife said:

I dont think anyone really understands it. Bill guerin is just proving to be a dumbass GM to join the list of all the other morons the wild have had run the team.

I am personally not ready to call him a dumbass gm yet. Yes where there is smoke there may be fire to this trade Rossi talk but do we actually know for sure? Here are some of the highlights why I don't think he has really been all that bad. 

- Took over a depleted prospect pool due to Fletcher and Fenton deals. 

-shipped out Zucker and Bruce got fired, finished 6th in central and brought in Dean. Also was covid season so a crap shoot.

-Guerin brought in Calen Addison, Alex Galchenyuk, a 2020 first-round pick (that turned into Carson Lambos), Bonino, and the 37th overall pick in 2020 (that turned into Khusnutdinov) for Zucker and Kunin.

-He then dealt Devan Dubnyk in the off-season as well as letting Wild captain, Mikko Koivu test free agency. Also the buyouts

-During Guerin's four years as the Wild GM, Minnesota set a franchise record for most wins with 53 during the 2021-22 season and did it with $12.74 million being paid to Parise and Suter who weren't on the team. 

-Kaapo Kahkonen to San Jose for Jacob Middleton, Kahkonen has posted a 3.64 goals-against average, a .890 save percentage, and a 11-26-8 record in 48 games for the Sharks.

Let go of Talbot for GusBus, who yes had a down year after a stellar year last year. The great looking extensions for Ek and Boldy.

-Had 13 1st and 2nd round picks in 4 years instead of trading them all away, this includes Liam Ohgren, Danila Yurov, and Khusnutdinov, Rossi, Lambos,  the wall and others. Brought in Faber on the trade for fiala as well as Ohgren as the pick.

To me while we may not like or want the extensions I am hard pressed to call him a dumbass for helping bring in that kind of potential skill and make some dang hard choices.  If the majority of picks don't pan out and once the cap hit drops off they don't improve as well as signing NOJO to a life contract, then yes I will agree. I think we are on the tail end of pulling out of the self destruction of previous GM's and starting to see the fruits of that labor.

[Dean]

Good article. I like the thinking. Watching this year’s playoffs, I’ve been interested in Mitch Marner, Elias Petterson , fiala ,  PLD, and what type of d cores are effective.  I’m glad Billy didn’t sign fiala now .i was wrong about keeping him. Watching his playoffs, I don’t think he’s worth his contract. Same with Marner and Petterson .  They seem to lack strength but there main problem is lack of mental toughness . PLD  has all the tools to be a dominant playoff player but not the mentality to do it . He is a problem for la with that contract. To pay him and fiala all that money to play 4 th line in playoffs is bad.  As far as d cores size does seem to be winning but Colorado speed is working also. However Colorado is big in there top 6 so I guess they are still a heavy team. Watching Vancouver it seems smaller Quinn Hughes and Hronek are having problems with the physical play but there huge d men are doing good . Edmonton got some size on there backend and a true power forward in Kane. They now look heavy and dangerous for years to come. 
     I like Rossi. I see why others really like him and want to give him time. However to me it’s all about kappy. He has that mental toughness that’s hard to find . We can’t easily  go find a kappy but we can find a comparable to rossi. Does Rossi have  the mental toughness for playoff hockey? Idk I’m guessing Billy doesn’t think so and that’s why he’s shopping him. I said before I didn’t think kappy has the drive to drive the team. I’m wrong he has the drive but not the teammates to drive . Maybe that’s what Billy is picking up on with Rossi . 
    IMO playoffs are about winning battles. Wanting to win them more than the other guy . Size and strength tend to beat skill at this time of year but not if your drive is stronger than other guy. It must be difficult for a gm to give out a 10 mil  long term contract only to find out the player can’t perform under stress in playoffs.  So not only is a good gm trying to find talent for there roster but they need to predict if that player will have the mental toughness for playoffs . It seems the wild can find talent to get them to playoffs but haven’t put a team of mentally strong players together to take next step. . 
   I read the sabers are looking to replace Casey m down the middle. Maybe we could pry one of those d men out of them for Rossi. I believe we need one big pairing on backend. 

[Dean]

Billy  has done good stuff and bad stuff . What he hasn’t done is get us past first round or given kappy a competitive team  I would argue he’s made this team more fragile  with his vets . 

[Protec]

Rossi trade talk IS stupid if it's 1 for 1 small change stuff. If he was part of a package to get a high quality player with intangibles then it could be worth it. 

MN has Spurgeon, Knudi, Rossi, Shaw, and Zuccarello all 5'9" or less. Do we really think that's the formula for going deep in the Western conference playoffs? Sounds foolish saying they play big after missing the playoffs and getting spanked in the Central. 

Why is the NHL a copycat league? 

Why is Guerin trying to fit a square peg in a round hole? This last season proved lazy vets, inexperienced young players, and gutless losing is the result of poorly balanced roster construction and dead money. Doing a repeat is the definition of insanity. I'm okay keeping Rossi if MN trades other little guys and builds up balance in the lineup. Having AHL tweeners, munchkins, nice-guys, hip-replacements, fun-lovin gluers, and soon to retire Swedes for half the roster is no long-term solution. 

Guerin showed up kinda a badass but is metamorphosizing into a dumbass before our eyes. Just buyout NoJo and sign Danton Heinen, Michael Amadio,  or Steven Lorentz. Then the Wild don't need to trade Rossi. NoJo needs to go. Maybe he'll get career ending diarrhea or his airway becomes obstructed from neck-beard whiskers. I hope.

 

[MNCountryLife]

Top: Ek, Kirill, Boldy,  ---- Brodin, Faber. 

Upper Middle: Rossi, Zuc --- Spurgeon

Lower Middle: Knut, Foligno, Hartman, --- Middleton

Bottom: Freddy, Nojo, Lettieri, Shaw, Luchinni, Ohgren -- Goligoski, Merrill, Bogo, Mermis, Chisholm

Way too many names fall into the bottom two categories.  What is worse is there are likely more players on this roster digressing rather than improving.  I am generally a pretty optimistic person, but I see little hope in this roster for 24-25.  

Are we really looking at moving one of the few players that has the potential to go up in a category.  I hope BG doesn't do that.  Move a bottom player or one that is digressing.  

[Patrick]

If we trade Rossi for a scoring winger all we would need to complete the 2nd line would be a young center!

[Citizen Strife]

14 minutes ago, Patrick said:

If we trade Rossi for a scoring winger all we would need to complete the 2nd line would be a young center!

But Patrick... where could we possibly find a young center?  Centers who score over 20 goals a season get picked in the Top 10...but where do we look to get those?

[Protec]

On defense Matt Roy is another RD with size who's a UFA and a big body.

Maybe we should be talking about trading Spurgeon.

[Up North Guy]

2 hours ago, MNCountryLife said:

Bottom: Freddy, Nojo, Lettieri, Shaw, Luchinni, Ohgren -- Goligoski, Merrill, Bogo, Mermis, Chisholm

Not sure I would put Ogie in that group just yet.

[kapislife]

4 hours ago, IllicitFive said:

I am personally not ready to call him a dumbass gm yet. Yes where there is smoke there may be fire to this trade Rossi talk but do we actually know for sure? Here are some of the highlights why I don't think he has really been all that bad. 

- Took over a depleted prospect pool due to Fletcher and Fenton deals. 

-shipped out Zucker and Bruce got fired, finished 6th in central and brought in Dean. Also was covid season so a crap shoot.

-Guerin brought in Calen Addison, Alex Galchenyuk, a 2020 first-round pick (that turned into Carson Lambos), Bonino, and the 37th overall pick in 2020 (that turned into Khusnutdinov) for Zucker and Kunin.

-He then dealt Devan Dubnyk in the off-season as well as letting Wild captain, Mikko Koivu test free agency. Also the buyouts

-During Guerin's four years as the Wild GM, Minnesota set a franchise record for most wins with 53 during the 2021-22 season and did it with $12.74 million being paid to Parise and Suter who weren't on the team. 

-Kaapo Kahkonen to San Jose for Jacob Middleton, Kahkonen has posted a 3.64 goals-against average, a .890 save percentage, and a 11-26-8 record in 48 games for the Sharks.

Let go of Talbot for GusBus, who yes had a down year after a stellar year last year. The great looking extensions for Ek and Boldy.

-Had 13 1st and 2nd round picks in 4 years instead of trading them all away, this includes Liam Ohgren, Danila Yurov, and Khusnutdinov, Rossi, Lambos,  the wall and others. Brought in Faber on the trade for fiala as well as Ohgren as the pick.

To me while we may not like or want the extensions I am hard pressed to call him a dumbass for helping bring in that kind of potential skill and make some dang hard choices.  If the majority of picks don't pan out and once the cap hit drops off they don't improve as well as signing NOJO to a life contract, then yes I will agree. I think we are on the tail end of pulling out of the self destruction of previous GM's and starting to see the fruits of that labor.

I liked him after the first couple seasons when he cleaned house and brought in some decent scouts. Then he started handing out chummy contracts to "gritty" vets and dudes he knew about in Pitt. He showing his true colors now and I wouldn't care if he got canned. The real person who needs to wake up and smell the dog shite is leupold. We needed a rebuild before cap came over and we could still use a miniature one. That should have been the plan for these cap strapped years woth the buyouts of the country club leaders

[Dis-allowed display name]

If Rossi was not someone they envisioned in their future why did they freaking draft him?  Is he not delivering on what they are asking of him?  He had a really good year. Trading him is stupid.

Edited April 30 by Dis-allowed display name

[Luke Sims]

This would bring a smile to my face.

[Dean]

This year I was under the impression kappy was onboard with what Billy is doing and the time it’s taking. So I was for being bad to get a top pick. After hearing this kappy apprehension about resigning. I think the total opposite. 
   It really makes you question this season and decisions made. Kappy wants the playoffs now and that’s the team Billy gave him. The extensions were a disaster that handcuffed us. No cap space killed us for injuries. The team is in disarray for most of the year and Billy can’t do anything about it. A year we are trying to prove to kappy we’re going in right direction . Then when we knew we weren’t playoff anything due to Billy’s roster , we can’t trade assets at deadline to get picks to use to buy what we need this year. Just the utter lack of urgency from the gm down to the players is stunning. No wonder kappy is apprehensive. 

[walt]

So much wrong in this article. 1st why trade away a center that out scores the wing that you want to trade him for? 2nd who centers the line that you just down graded?  3rd Rossi never played in the Q. 4th just stop with this trade Rossi nonsense, we have no one to replace him with. 5th Rossi is the ultimate teammate that works his butt off. Can't wait till they sign Rossi to a bridge deal so this junk goes away.

[Dean]

If I understand this correctly. Billy has himself in a position where he’s in last year of big cap penalties but also in last year of playoffs to prove to kappy it’s worth signing. The following year he’ll have to be traded or signed before trade deadline. No playoffs to decide. That’s a terrible position to be in. I don’t think it Billy’s fault the timing of two.  It’s just not ideal! 

[Need4speed99]

9 hours ago, OldDutchChip said:

Pick a Wild team with Rossi or with Kaprizov

It will not be with both

Once you decided, you’ll know what needs to be done and why

Vegas did not win by holding on to Tuch when there was a chance to upgrade

florida did not hesitate to send out 100pt player for Tkachuk

Rossi is neither Tuch nor is he a future 100 pt player, if we can package him and another prize for a stud like tkachuk, we do it immediately 

 

 

[Need4speed99]

Except in your best case scenario you aren't trading for tachuck or paladin or any of that. 

You need to re evaluate your expectations than figure reality and proceed accordingly.

This team is set for the youngsters to come up. They do NOT have the cap space to sign big name vets. We gotta let the prospects play and stupidity would dictate trying to overpay for a big name vet. Who you'd you go after and what could you actually get?

This is stupid and exactly how they end up in the same cycle of being stuck in the middle.

Rossi looks like an early eek, if that is the case, giving up on him is stupid.