Article: Wild Shutout Ducks, But Lose Brodin After Brutal Injury

[Thomas Williams]

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[viper3119]

And our defense is going to be crap again. This season was lost to injuries.

[Gritty.Not.Pretty]

Wasn’t able to watch the game so I didn’t see the interference penalties, but that was unnecessary. He was not “finishing the check” as the puck was down in the corner for some time before Killer threw Brodin to the ice. So much for refs, so much for player “safety”

 

Edited March 20 by Gritty.Not.Pretty

[MNCountryLife]

You can't win without a deep D core.  Losing Spurge this year really hurt us.  Losing Brodin will make this push to the playoffs nearly impossible.  I couldn't figure out what he injured but it looks to be upper body.  Hope he has a quick recovery.

[MNCountryLife]

Hmmm.  reports are that it is lower body leg injury.  Anyone have more information?

[mnfaninnc]

47 minutes ago, Gritty.Not.Pretty said:

Wasn’t able to watch the game so I didn’t see the interference penalties, but that was unnecessary. He was not “finishing the check” as the puck was down in the corner for some time before Killer threw Brodin to the ice. So much for refs, so much for player “safety”

You're absolutely right, it was not finishing a check. At the time, the game had started to turn chippy but it may not have been Killorn pinning him against the boards, but rather how Brodin fell. 

Regardless of this, once again, an important player struggles to get to the bench, in clear view of the entire bench, and in a 3-0 game nobody does anything to protect a teammate. This has got to change if we're going to get anywhere. You cannot rely on referees or DoPS to police things for you, this must be done by the team. Yet, absolutely no pushback. Perhaps they didn't think it was dirty? However, down at the other end, it look like someone took some liberties with Faber too. 

Other game notes were that I thought Beckman had a strong game, even before his assist. He was noticeable in a good way. Also, he's got to realize that he must be taking the body on the forecheck, it simply has to happen and if you're on the 4th line, it really should be mandatory. Dino also had a strong game and while he didn't showcase his speed, you could see the acceleration as he changes gears very smoothly. Dino also doesn't seem to get knocked around quite as much as Rossi does.....hmmm. 

Hartman also had a strong game, especially when they switched to Foligno as one of the wings. It seems like he and Foligno have some good chemistry together. And of course, your 3rd guy is Boldy who plays well with anyone. 

This is 2 straight games where Goose2 has been real good too. 

I'm blocked from tonight's game, let's see if they can gain some ground! 4-0 was about the right score for that game. Gudas was still out.

[Protec]

Looks to me like a right wrist, hand, or lower arm for Brodin. Funny bone in the first period is probably something you'd bounce back from. Gonna assume this is a 4-6 week deal.

[IllicitFive]

15 minutes ago, MNCountryLife said:

Hmmm.  reports are that it is lower body leg injury.  Anyone have more information?

Brodin (lower body) will have an MRI on Wednesday but reportedly hasn't damaged his ACL, per Michael Russo of The Athletic.

Hockey never gives much information, but at least not ACL. Maybe a bullet dodged and only a couple games? Hyperextension?

[mnfaninnc]

37 minutes ago, Protec said:

Looks to me like a right wrist, hand, or lower arm for Brodin. Funny bone in the first period is probably something you'd bounce back from. Gonna assume this is a 4-6 week deal.

If this were the case, why would he stay down so long and only be able to glide on his left skate? Could he have injured 2 things? He wasn't putting any weight on his right leg when he got off the ice.

[Will D. Ness]

34 minutes ago, IllicitFive said:

Brodin (lower body) will have an MRI on Wednesday but reportedly hasn't damaged his ACL, per Michael Russo of The Athletic.

Hockey never gives much information, but at least not ACL. Maybe a bullet dodged and only a couple games? Hyperextension?

Good news... kind of.

[mnfaninnc]

One thing bothers me about the Servac Petrovsky not getting signed thing: In the most recent past, when Guerin wasn't going to resign a prospect, he traded them. If he's not signing Petrovsky one would think that he'd have traded his rights at the deadline, not allow him back into the draft.

Maybe this is simply a "not yet" on signing him. Owen Sound is pretty far down the depth chart of the standings. I would think they will be one and done in their playoff matchup. I would have to assume, then, he gets his ELC for next season and reports to Iowa this season on a PTO for a couple of games.

[Protec]

6 minutes ago, mnfaninnc said:

If this were the case, why would he stay down so long and only be able to glide on his left skate? Could he have injured 2 things? He wasn't putting any weight on his right leg when he got off the ice.

Good point, I am on EST so admittedly I just watched the clips this morning. 😁

[Protec]

10 minutes ago, mnfaninnc said:

One thing bothers me about the Servac Petrovsky not getting signed thing: In the most recent past, when Guerin wasn't going to resign a prospect, he traded them. If he's not signing Petrovsky one would think that he'd have traded his rights at the deadline, not allow him back into the draft.

Maybe this is simply a "not yet" on signing him. Owen Sound is pretty far down the depth chart of the standings. I would think they will be one and done in their playoff matchup. I would have to assume, then, he gets his ELC for next season and reports to Iowa this season on a PTO for a couple of games.

It could be argued that the Wild are full and holding this kid up on his hockey path if you don't have a spot for him wouldn't be the right thing. 

Perhaps Guerin couldn't get anything but he tried? I see it as more of the Sokolov or Khavanov type things where we hoped a guy would get there and be impressive. It just never happens and you can't wait or hold out for everyone. 

Now if Petrovksy goes to Chicago and becomes a 30-goal scorer we can rip Guerin a new one and demand he's fired.

[MNCountryLife]

1 hour ago, IllicitFive said:

Brodin (lower body) will have an MRI on Wednesday but reportedly hasn't damaged his ACL, per Michael Russo of The Athletic.

Hockey never gives much information, but at least not ACL. Maybe a bullet dodged and only a couple games? Hyperextension?

Thanks for the heads up.  Let's hope for the best.

[IllicitFive]

2 hours ago, mnfaninnc said:

You're absolutely right, it was not finishing a check. At the time, the game had started to turn chippy but it may not have been Killorn pinning him against the boards, but rather how Brodin fell. 

Regardless of this, once again, an important player struggles to get to the bench, in clear view of the entire bench, and in a 3-0 game nobody does anything to protect a teammate. This has got to change if we're going to get anywhere. You cannot rely on referees or DoPS to police things for you, this must be done by the team. Yet, absolutely no pushback. Perhaps they didn't think it was dirty? However, down at the other end, it look like someone took some liberties with Faber too. 

 

My only concern is, and yes being up 3 is different, but taking penalties for a bad check or instigator and giving a team you have buried some life. I am torn on it, while yes, liberties should be returned in kind, taking dumb penalties and perhaps creating a reputation as a goon team may not be great. Refs might look closer and call more penalties if you have that reputation. 

[Willy the poor boy]

2 hours ago, IllicitFive said:

My only concern is, and yes being up 3 is different, but taking penalties for a bad check or instigator and giving a team you have buried some life. I am torn on it, while yes, liberties should be returned in kind, taking dumb penalties and perhaps creating a reputation as a goon team may not be great. Refs might look closer and call more penalties if you have that reputation. 

The team needs to develop a reputation that when you go after our top line guys we go after yours. Once that rep is developed it would go a long way towards an end to them going after KK and those types of players.

That being said, I don't think the play on Brodin was all that egregious. It happens multiple times in a game.

[IllicitFive]

5 minutes ago, Willy the poor boy said:

The team needs to develop a reputation that when you go after our top line guys we go after yours. Once that rep is developed it would go a long way towards an end to them going after KK and those types of players.

That being said, I don't think the play on Brodin was all that egregious. It happens multiple times in a game.

Are you advocating for good hard clean hits, which don't always present themselves on the right guy by the player who could bring the pain? Dirty play, now you are hurting the team as a whole going on penalty kills, and depends on severity multiple or a 5 min? Because for a fight, there needs to be two willing partners.  Its easy to say they must answer, the hard part is how and when.

[Willy the poor boy]

14 minutes ago, IllicitFive said:

Are you advocating for good hard clean hits, which don't always present themselves on the right guy by the player who could bring the pain? Dirty play, now you are hurting the team as a whole going on penalty kills, and depends on severity multiple or a 5 min? Because for a fight, there needs to be two willing partners.  Its easy to say they must answer, the hard part is how and when.

Just a couple of examples that come to mind, last night Killorn wasn't called. I don't believe Suter was called one time for beating on KK in last years playoff series. The hits don't have to be dirty they just need to take the opportunities to hit the other teams top players. I don't even know if they have to take the bull by the horns but they def need to respond and do it consistently.

[IllicitFive]

6 minutes ago, Willy the poor boy said:

Just a couple of examples that come to mind, last night Killorn wasn't called. I don't believe Suter was called one time for beating on KK in last years playoff series. The hits don't have to be dirty they just need to take the opportunities to hit the other teams top players. I don't even know if they have to take the bull by the horns but they def need to respond and do it consistently.

That's what I am asking though, how do you recommend doing so? Just hope the hit lines up? It is not a good idea to get yourself out of position and give up a goal for a hit.  Hockey is very position oriented, you are out of position someone has to try to cover and then you get into a bad situation where someone is open for a prime scoring chance. If the opportunity comes to lay the wood they should be doing that anyway, but not at the the risk of giving up goals.

[Protec]

If it's a guy like Suter who plays defense, you can dump the puck into his corner without risking giving up a goal. With a guy like Killorn, perhaps you need to pester him or have some words to convey a threat they believe in. Maybe it works, maybe it doesn't. For MN, it probably doesn't. It's the game within the game. You don't wanna take a penalty or cost your team so you can't jump guys. I miss Dumba though cause he could catch a forward sometimes cleanly.

 

[mnfaninnc]

7 hours ago, IllicitFive said:

My only concern is, and yes being up 3 is different, but taking penalties for a bad check or instigator and giving a team you have buried some life. I am torn on it, while yes, liberties should be returned in kind, taking dumb penalties and perhaps creating a reputation as a goon team may not be great. Refs might look closer and call more penalties if you have that reputation. 

Here is where we are now: We look to the referees and DoPS who couldn't care less about our well being. They do absolutely nothing to protect a Wild player's safety except for maybe Fleury. The worst thing that the Wild will do is bark at the refs about it. They know this. This is our reputation. 

Staal gets crosschecked in the neck for the whole world to see, and we do nothing. Staal gets thrown head first into the boards the next year and we do nothing. Kaprizov gets repeatedly crosschecked by Suter, and we do nothing. Granlund gets manhandled by Byfuglien and bodyslammed to the ice and we do nothing. And the same thing has happened this year to Brodin, twice and we do nothing. This is our reputation.

At least last year Hartman stood up and had the guts to reverse hit Ehlers. He went after a skill player who was important to that team, and pretty much wrecked the rest of his season. Why? Because he had a Jets logo on the front of his jersey and they deserved payback.

We are up by 3. Ducks are getting chippy and one of our guys gets hurt for really no reason costing us another very talented player out with injury. Illicit, you don't think they deserve having a skilled player run? You know why our players get run, because our reputation is being a bunch of candy asses. 

And the only people who can change that reputation are the 20 guys on that bench. Refs will swallow whistles because they know we won't do anything but bark. Other teams will take liberties because they know we won't hold them accountable. This is unacceptable. 

I want 2 points as bad as anybody. Sometimes, you just have to not ask someone to go but manhandle them until they drop their gloves. Sometimes, it's plainly just a crushing hit where you line up a skilled guy and make sure you follow through hard. Sometimes, it's the ability to throw out that heavy line where all they do is track down a player and hit him hard. 

Point #1 is you have to stick up for your teammates. If the Wild felt like this was just an unfortunate accident, well that's them, but they have a history of doing nothing and this is no different. Until this reputation changes, other teams and players, referees and DoPS will feel free to take liberties and swallow whistles. 

You know who gets preferential treatment with these things where referees know they will lose their minds? Boston and Philadelphia. You know who gets calls to make sure things are settled down? Those 2 franchises. You know what happens when the DoPS overlooks an infraction against those 2 franchises? Fireworks the next time they play that team. The NHL does not want that and any referee knows they will be highly scrutinized if a game gets out of their control. 

The Wild are not the only ones with this reputation problem either, but they have to change the narrative. I'm not suggesting that last night's game was the time to go '80s night, but there is a time for that, and the Wild need to show that they also carry that club in their bag. Why? Because referees fear that, it is the one thing they fear the most. It is also the one thing that gets them in more trouble than anything, losing control of a game. Yes, there will be repercussions, but it is the only way to change the narrative. 

Think about this for a minute. Philly and Boston gained this reputation in the '70s, and it is still their reputation today. Once in awhile they remind the hockey world of this reputation, just to make sure they know it still applies. 

[IllicitFive]

10 hours ago, mnfaninnc said:

Here is where we are now: We look to the referees and DoPS who couldn't care less about our well being. They do absolutely nothing to protect a Wild player's safety except for maybe Fleury. The worst thing that the Wild will do is bark at the refs about it. They know this. This is our reputation. 

Staal gets crosschecked in the neck for the whole world to see, and we do nothing. Staal gets thrown head first into the boards the next year and we do nothing. Kaprizov gets repeatedly crosschecked by Suter, and we do nothing. Granlund gets manhandled by Byfuglien and bodyslammed to the ice and we do nothing. And the same thing has happened this year to Brodin, twice and we do nothing. This is our reputation.

At least last year Hartman stood up and had the guts to reverse hit Ehlers. He went after a skill player who was important to that team, and pretty much wrecked the rest of his season. Why? Because he had a Jets logo on the front of his jersey and they deserved payback.

We are up by 3. Ducks are getting chippy and one of our guys gets hurt for really no reason costing us another very talented player out with injury. Illicit, you don't think they deserve having a skilled player run? You know why our players get run, because our reputation is being a bunch of candy asses. 

And the only people who can change that reputation are the 20 guys on that bench. Refs will swallow whistles because they know we won't do anything but bark. Other teams will take liberties because they know we won't hold them accountable. This is unacceptable. 

I want 2 points as bad as anybody. Sometimes, you just have to not ask someone to go but manhandle them until they drop their gloves. Sometimes, it's plainly just a crushing hit where you line up a skilled guy and make sure you follow through hard. Sometimes, it's the ability to throw out that heavy line where all they do is track down a player and hit him hard. 

Point #1 is you have to stick up for your teammates. If the Wild felt like this was just an unfortunate accident, well that's them, but they have a history of doing nothing and this is no different. Until this reputation changes, other teams and players, referees and DoPS will feel free to take liberties and swallow whistles. 

You know who gets preferential treatment with these things where referees know they will lose their minds? Boston and Philadelphia. You know who gets calls to make sure things are settled down? Those 2 franchises. You know what happens when the DoPS overlooks an infraction against those 2 franchises? Fireworks the next time they play that team. The NHL does not want that and any referee knows they will be highly scrutinized if a game gets out of their control. 

The Wild are not the only ones with this reputation problem either, but they have to change the narrative. I'm not suggesting that last night's game was the time to go '80s night, but there is a time for that, and the Wild need to show that they also carry that club in their bag. Why? Because referees fear that, it is the one thing they fear the most. It is also the one thing that gets them in more trouble than anything, losing control of a game. Yes, there will be repercussions, but it is the only way to change the narrative. 

Think about this for a minute. Philly and Boston gained this reputation in the '70s, and it is still their reputation today. Once in awhile they remind the hockey world of this reputation, just to make sure they know it still applies. 

Stats show Minnesota leads the league in fighting, with 35, next is Nashville with 27.... Looks like they are standing up, and per your argument above teams are still taking liberties even though the wild fight more than anyone else. I fully agree taking a heavy body to someone in another jersey if you have the opportunity, running them, in the way I understand that, is different. I understand that term to mean going out of your way to take a head off, dirty of not, that will also get you a rep as a dirty team that refs will watch for and call more borderline calls. The reputations you bring up are from 50, yes 50, years ago. The game and what was allowed was a bit different then. Their "rep" is more a nickname that has stuck, not necessarily what they are still known for in todays NHL. Outside of The Rat, who on Boston is still the tough guy? Who on the flyers do players fear? Their whole team? The team with the 2nd fewest hit per game this year, Colorado, they must take cheap shots all the time.

In short, fighting more than any other team hasn't stopped it, the era of 70s era goon hockey are dead, and to run someone, I will assume you just mean taking a good hard clean hit, is tough to due when big hitters are typically slower and trying to catch a shifty smaller guy who will dance around or dish the puck. If you take the run then you may get a penalty. If that is that case then the wild will be known to take cheap shots and give you multiple opportunities on the PP for easier goals.

[MNCountryLife]

2 hours ago, IllicitFive said:

In short, fighting more than any other team hasn't stopped it

Agreed... An effective power play does way more.  

[mnfaninnc]

2 hours ago, IllicitFive said:

Stats show Minnesota leads the league in fighting, with 35, next is Nashville with 27.... Looks like they are standing up, and per your argument above teams are still taking liberties even though the wild fight more than anyone else.

Fighting penalties and standing up for teammate fighting penalties are completely different. I can't believe the Wild have 35 fights this season, most of them must have been in the blacked out/blocked games I haven't been able to watch. 

I was blocked from last night's game, but had a chance to see the Middleton fight on YouTube, and the Hartman "unsportsmanlike conduct" fight against PLD where the gutless PLD refused to drop. However, I was unable to find anything on the 10 10 minute misconduct penalties called with about 5 minutes and change left in the game. 

And, yes, by run a guy, I mean a clean hard hit where you set the guy up and crush him legally. Of course, like explained by Protec, it is easier to do this to a defenseman, but a guy like Bogosian can also set up a forward on a retrieval and staple him to the boards with a message. An ensuing fight is not necessarily the only way to respond, but the Wild do have a reputation of being a bunch of candy asses and it needs to change. 

Getting back to last night, this is the 2nd time this season that Middleton has had to step up to "protect" a forward, in this case it was Johansson. One could argue that Foligno's bout with Carrier was a response from the previous game, and as alluded to earlier, Hartman's reverse hit on Ehlers was legal and definitely pay back for Kaprizov getting sat on. 

As I said earlier, referees greatly fear the loss of control in a game. Since I couldn't watch, I suspect that the Kings game started to get pretty chippy in the 3rd period. Is that true? Last season, we saw 10s get handed out in the Dallas game just for players being on the active roster. They didn't do anything, and the referees didn't want them to do anything, so sent them packing. What happened last night? 

My bet is that the referees could feel a possible meltdown coming and just gave everyone 10s to try and keep control. Down 6-0, it was a good time for a meltdown, too, from the Wild perspective. And, you can bet that doing that in LA will get the medias full attention. I believe this was the referees response to the fear of losing control and then being heavily scrutinized by the league. Our narrative hasn't changed yet, but there may be fear that it will!

Yes, 50 years have gone by since the Boston and Philly franchises have earned their reputations. But, they have not shed that reputation no matter how their stats look today. Once in awhile they remind the league that they can meltdown at any time, and the officials every year appease them. It also doesn't hurt that both teams have some rabid fans that will encourage it too. 50 years is a long time to be carrying that kind of reputation, but it is still alive. 

[mnfaninnc]

23 minutes ago, MNCountryLife said:

Agreed... An effective power play does way more.  

Well, since we don't have one of those yet, we have to find another way. But, when you have a situation like Brodin, no PP was awarded so that made no difference, especially when the game was out of reach for the Ducks. 

Just like last night in the 3rd period when the Wild had nothing to lose, so what, you lose a penalty battle down 6-0.