Article: Wild Keep Zach Bogosian, Reportedly Re-sign Defenseman To 2-Year Deal

[Imyourhuckleberry]

1 hour ago, Lovehockey said:

how can we claim that Guerin at least good with selecting talent if for the 5 years of him being here the only his guys who is playing is Rossi

The 2019 NHL Entry Draft was the 57th NHL Entry Draft. The draft was held on June 21–22, 2019. On August 21, 2019, Guerin was named the fourth general manager of the Minnesota Wild.

Guerin didn't make an NHL selection until the summer of 2020. Rossi & Khusnutdinov were the first 2 picks of his GM career and both are on the Wild now. He later added Brock Faber from that 2020 draft class. Daemon Hunt was selected 3rd round that year and appears to be on the cusp of making the Wild.

2021 pick, Wallstedt, is likely 1 year away. 2022 picks, Ohgren & Yurov, might be 1-2 years away. Lambos could be ready for 25-26. It is Guerin's fifth season as GM, but he only has selected 4 draft classes so far.

[MacGyver]

It would be helpful to know what the Leafs were offering in order to gauge this contract. Bogosian made no secret of his desire to stay here. This could be more about BG doing one of "his guys" a solid other than the best thing for the team. BG just loves guys who want to stay here and over values that to a fault. Started with Gologoski and then Merril and of course Fluery.

[Pewterschmidt]

7 hours ago, Tony Abbott said:

And no one wants the Wild to have Merrill in Year 2 of this deal!!

The ads are wrecking the mobile experience again.  Page reloads repeatedly, pop ups , etc

[Imyourhuckleberry]

The Athletic has an article regarding the proliferation of NHL no movement clauses that people may find interesting. Here are a couple excerpts.

Quote

In 2018-19, there were 170 players with some form of protection in their contracts. In the past six seasons, that has gone up 44.1 percent.

Add it all up and you’ve got a quarter of the league (245 of 965 players) entering Friday’s trade deadline with more say than ever about where they can and can’t be moved. That’s nearly eight players per team. And it would be more, but players must be 27 years old or have seven seasons of NHL service to be eligible for such clauses.

Toronto(14), Seattle(14), Pittsburgh(13), and Detroit(12) are the 4 teams who have more players than the Wild(11) with some movement protections included in contracts as we head towards the 2024 trade deadline. Over half of the league has at least 8 contracts that restrict player movement.

Quote

“The guys always say, ‘Well, he’s got it and he’s got it,’” Wild GM Bill Guerin said. “We have quite a few, and I’ve taken some criticism for giving out so many, but they’re players we like, and I don’t foresee trading them. If something goes sour, then we can talk to the player about it. But I believe in the players we’ve given them to.”

[FredJohnson]

Any trade clauses??

Asking for a friend.

[FredJohnson]

2 hours ago, Pewterschmidt said:

The ads are wrecking the mobile experience again.  Page reloads repeatedly, pop ups , etc

Download the "Duck Duck Go" browser.

[B1GKappa97]

9 hours ago, Tony Abbott said:

It's also a what? 450K raise?

Yeah, exactly. Even if he turns into Merrill 2.0 its not a back-breaking contract by any means and it'll be nice to have a guy with his size on the 3rd pair. 

He's like double the size of Calen Addison! 

[Citizen Strife]

One thing I do think helps Bogosian a little is he's big, but not a complete doofus while skating.  He's kinda like Middleton, where he's willing to go into the offensive zone if necessary, but isn't dumb enough to get caught all that often.  If he's hitting dudes and disrupting play even a little, it can make all the difference.  A 6'3", 215-225lb defenseman is way different than a 5'11" 175-190 lbs defenseman like say Addison was. 

Sure, they were two completely different styles of defender.  But at +3 vs. whatever Addison is or has been (-15 or -20), the worst you can say about Bogosian is he's not going to cough up things as often.  If it's between Bogo or the other options (Mermis, Hunt, Addison), Bogo has something different to offer right now.  There's every chance that Hunt or Lambos are 7/8 next year, so they should still get chances to grow.  If Bogo ends up like Goligoski and he just has ZERO speed at some point, yeah, it will look like a waste of a roster spot.

I can't wait for Middleton to get back with Spurgeon, cause his +/- is fucking garbage (-12), but maybe that's because he and Faber are trying to be more aggressive.

[Citizen Strife]

Another thing I wanted to mention is the uncertainty over Spurgeon.  There's every chance that he's going to be just fine.  However, Spurgeon's game is foot speed, overall defense, and reacting to plays.  If he's not back to 100%, or he can't be counted on as that defensive wizard anymore, this year sure showed what having a lack of depth can do.  Unless the Wild somehow pick a super big or super strong and ready to go defenseman in the draft...they don't really have a Faber that comes out of nowhere and took their spot.  That's probably why they took Chisholm in the first place.  There's every chance they decide to shore up a weak forward/wing corps instead.

[Imyourhuckleberry]

13 minutes ago, B1GKappa97 said:

Even if he turns into Merrill 2.0 its not a back-breaking contract by any means and it'll be nice to have a guy with his size on the 3rd pair. 

He's like double the size of Calen Addison! 

Bogo delivers about 2 hits per game while Merrill delivers about 1 hit every 2 games. That size and playing heavy are things Guerin wants on that 3rd pairing, and Bogo has been pretty solid for the Wild. Doesn't seem like a bad deal.

[WIWild]

44 minutes ago, Imyourhuckleberry said:

The Athletic has an article regarding the proliferation of NHL no movement clauses that people may find interesting.

Also, check out the latest Wild on 7th pod, for Nanne's thoughts on NTCs (and many other things).

[Protec]

47 minutes ago, B1GKappa97 said:

He's like double the size of Calen Addison! 

And 100X the righteous facial moss...

[mnfaninnc]

16 hours ago, Tony Abbott said:

Zach Bogosian is one of the 25 worst defensemen of the cap era, and while his 47 games have been shockingly decent, we're doing Jon Merrill all over again.

I like this deal. If you like the guy and know what he brings, why go shopping elsewhere for a late round pick? Obviously, Bogosian has been better than Merrill and he's now paid equally. 

Both are large bodied defenders, though Bogosian is right handed. He fills a need on that right side to shut down and kill penalties and clear the net. He's more like Soucy was when we had him there. He didn't look horrible playing up a pairing and he'll definitely use the body way more than Merrill. In fact, the only similarity between Bogosian and Merrill is that they have similar reach. 

Tony, you've said this off and on about Bogosian and how you don't like the player and think he's trash. But, the eye test says differently. He's not going to put up fantastic offensive numbers. He's going to defend hard, make life miserable if you want to get to the paint, and play physical, something we need. He plays well within our system, will carry the puck at times, isn't too fancy with it and gets his shot off quickly. I think his main quality, though, is he allows Middleton to play more aggressively and physically too, because there's another big defender on the back lines. 

Perhaps we simply disagree that the Wild need players like this, in fact, all teams need players like this. If we make the playoffs this season, which is highly doubtful, Bogosian is exactly the type of player we have missed the last 2 runs. We've watched opposing PPs just walk right to the paint and jam pucks in. This is what Bogosian is good at stopping, specifically on the right side!

[mnfaninnc]

10 hours ago, Lovehockey said:

Well this is what we have:

Spurgen - 34 (on decline, undersized)

Bogo - 34

Brodin - 30

Middleton - 28

Merrill- 32

And absolutely no chance for improvement at least one more year. So add couple of years to these guys, and tell me why Kaprisov would want to re-sign with Minnesota (unless he really likes our lakes).

and he would not sign why Yurov would want to rush to get here. 

And in addition how can we claim that Guerin at least good with selecting talent if for the 5 years of him being here the only his guys who is playing is Rossi

I think what is missing here is that these guys are holding down the fort until the others arrive. Faber and Chisholm are surprisingly missing from this lineup as is Hunt (another of Guerin's guys). I think there was optimism that Lambos would be one and done in Iowa. I think that plan has changed as he has struggled to adjust in the A. 

Another of Guerin's guys starts next week in Dino. That would be 3 guys from that draft class. 4 if you count Faber. When you're drafting in the late teens and early 20s, you almost have to look at the 4-5 year availability window. They are on year 4 right now. 

I think that Yurov has signaled Guerin that he wants to come. He needs a separate signal from Guerin that he is welcome, and I believe that will come in the trading of the Deweys. By the way, Yurov coming in next season or the year after puts him ahead of schedule.

[mnfaninnc]

4 hours ago, MacGyver said:

It would be helpful to know what the Leafs were offering in order to gauge this contract. Bogosian made no secret of his desire to stay here. This could be more about BG doing one of "his guys" a solid other than the best thing for the team. BG just loves guys who want to stay here and over values that to a fault. Started with Gologoski and then Merril and of course Fluery.

Or, maybe Guerin noticed what I noticed dating back to the expansion draft: We had nobody with size on the right hand side to defend. Soucy's frame was a big loss, and losing Cole also left a huge hole. He got Midsy, but we needed 2 bigger defenders. We also needed a little nasty and Bogosian brings that.

Him wanting to be here is merely a bonus!

[Willy the poor boy]

2 hours ago, Imyourhuckleberry said:

The Athletic has an article regarding the proliferation of NHL no movement clauses that people may find interesting. Here are a couple excerpts.

Toronto(14), Seattle(14), Pittsburgh(13), and Detroit(12) are the 4 teams who have more players than the Wild(11) with some movement protections included in contracts as we head towards the 2024 trade deadline. Over half of the league has at least 8 contracts that restrict player movement.

I had heard recently that Guerin had a deal to trade Golly at the deadline last season and Golly nixed it. I hadn't heard that before. 

[Pewterschmidt]

44 minutes ago, mnfaninnc said:

don't like the player and think he's trash. But, the eye test says differently.

BINGO!  Now there’s always the risk of this being a full NoJo-fa head fake, but I believe that Bogo is not heartless and gutless like nojofa.  
 

Will Bogo only get slower? Of course but he’ll always have size and BG is betting he’ll still be willing to use it. And for a 3rd pairing D that’s enough

[Pewterschmidt]

41 minutes ago, mnfaninnc said:

I think there was optimism that Lambos would be one and done in Iowa.

If I’m not mistaken Lambo was the first of the Judd bracket can’t miss defenseman

[Citizen Strife]

That's the thing though.  You can't play some waiting game forever.  If Lambos isn't ready now, who is to say he ever will?  What does his "getting it" look like, and is that a better use of time and space on a roster?  A GMs job isn't just to look at what fits for a team in the future, but if there's no sure way to know, why fuck up right now?

It was the same thing with Addison.  Guerin decided the Addison of last year and this year wasn't worth banking on the Addison from 3-5 years from now, if people like Faber, Chisholm, and even Bogo play better than him now.

Any and all prospects are just that: opportunities.  We could say Guerin is tentative at just fielding an all youth team and letting them sink or swim, but who knows what player will fit with what team when.

 

[Tony Abbott]

2 hours ago, B1GKappa97 said:

Yeah, exactly. Even if he turns into Merrill 2.0 its not a back-breaking contract by any means and it'll be nice to have a guy with his size on the 3rd pair. 

He's like double the size of Calen Addison! 

If he's costing you a point in the standings, any amount of money spent on him is potentially back-breaking.

[Tony Abbott]

1 hour ago, mnfaninnc said:

Tony, you've said this off and on about Bogosian and how you don't like the player and think he's trash. But, the eye test says differently. He's not going to put up fantastic offensive numbers. He's going to defend hard, make life miserable if you want to get to the paint, and play physical, something we need. He plays well within our system, will carry the puck at times, isn't too fancy with it and gets his shot off quickly.

He's done it through 43 games. Is he going to do this over the next two years? History says no.

[mnfaninnc]

1 hour ago, Citizen Strife said:

That's the thing though.  You can't play some waiting game forever.  If Lambos isn't ready now, who is to say he ever will?  What does his "getting it" look like, and is that a better use of time and space on a roster?  A GMs job isn't just to look at what fits for a team in the future,

I think Lambos will be very good. On a typical developmental path you are exactly right. On Lambos' path, and really the rest of the D prospects, we have to admit that the Covid missed years are going to individually make the normal time lines a bit wonky.

The goal I'd have for Lambos was experience in the A this season, followed by coming into camp chiseled at 205 next season, knowing he needed the strength/weight to compete correctly. If he does this, he may be the last cut from camp or make the team.

Honestly, the same thing goes for Chisholm, he needs a big strength/weight offseason. He's got the A experience, now he just needs to be bigger. Sometimes, you just have to build yourself to your division, and it appears as if the Central Division is going to be full of large bodies. 

[mnfaninnc]

1 hour ago, Tony Abbott said:

He's done it through 43 games. Is he going to do this over the next two years? History says no.

But his history is with different organizations. Could it be he found a really good fit here with system and expectations? Perhaps having forwards come back a little harder helps him?

In his words, here he's gotten opportunity, not healthy scratched, not just 3rd pairing minutes, but he's gotten to play. Some guys need a few more minutes to stay engaged, and he's still below the 20 mark. 

My main point and argument here is that by the metrics used to say he is a bottom 25 defenseman in the league, perhaps his strengths do not show up on those metrics, yet he is very useful in what he does well.

Maybe it's not Bogosian who's trash, maybe it's the metrics that need to be thrown out?

[Tony Abbott]

What have the Minnesota Wild figured out systematically that the Tampa Bay Lightning haven't? 

[B1GKappa97]

3 hours ago, Protec said:

And 100X the righteous facial moss...

god that stache was so disturbing